partial seizures/music trigger/goosebumps?

[petero]

I'm wondering if I may be on track with something and if someone may be able to relate a similar type of experience

often when I'm listening to music, and it's usually techno/electronica, I've gotten (and have gotten for quite some time, maybe throughout my life, but techno seems to be the most assured "trigger" for this to happen) the goosebumps sensation throughout my body -

I'd really considered it just goosebumps, because it'll happen with music I really looovee - deep thick bass, saw waves, square waves, higher frequencies of larger amplitude...

you know the THX Dolby thing they play before movies?
everyone probably gets that "buzz" throughout their bodies listening to that..

but I'll get sensations that will be like goosebumps up my spine, into my head
it doesn't seem just like a cutaneous nerve stimulation thing

and since I've had a few T/C seizures, and got diagnosed, I'd re-thought these goosebump sensations and wondered if they might actually be music-triggered simple partial seizures of some sort

what makes me skeptical is that it can be very specific - I could probably pick out a few songs and trigger this to happen automatically - and from what I understand about seizures, it doesn't sound that easy

what makes me believe this could be actual is the breadth and complexity of sound waveforms in this type of music
and honestly, that when I was really immersed into this music scene in the 1990's-early 2000's, clubs, raves, I had done a variety of drugs - types of drugs "they" say could be gateways to seizure activity
and I began suspecting that my brain may have synchronized certain sound waveforms, frequencies and things, with this brain activity

I do recall having these types of goosebump reactions to music throughout my life - but it seemed to become more pronounced as I aged

what also makes me skeptical of this phenomenon is that I am acutely aware of my surroundings, and at times can seem to exit this sensation at will, and re-enter at will - as long as the trigger stimulus persists
(like I can come in and out of the song)


I can differentiate between goosebumps and this other sensation/zone
and unless there's a very large spectrum on the goosebump scale, I wonder about it


simple partial? goosebumps?

if it's the prior, I should get to an epileptologist and his EEG with a doobie and Prodigy's "Fat of the Land" and give him plenty of meat for a thesis


for an idea of the tone types I'm talking about

listen to the background, sans lyrics and drums, especially pronounced at about 0:22 of the track

(saw waves through some sort of phaser, or filtering...)

 

[DayDreamer]

If those goosebumps experiences were similar to other seizure events or bothered your consciousness I would count them as seizures, otherwise I would enjoy them as a musical event. Who knows.

My music trigger seizures start with similar feelings to some of my other seizures and sometimes affect my consciousness if I don't deal with it quickly. Different parts of our brains might be affected and have developed weird pathways.

Maybe you are just enjoying music. If you had never recieved sexual education and been diagnosed with epilepsy at age two then opened a sex magazine during puberty and your phallus rose would you count that as a seizure?

 

[petero]

Maybe you are just enjoying music. If you had never recieved sexual education and been diagnosed with epilepsy at age two then opened a sex magazine during puberty and your phallus rose would you count that as a seizure?

no - I'd count that as sexual excitement
if I'd had a sustained, through a substantial part of my lifetime, and increasing excitation brought on by music - should I count that as a seizure?

I didn't know what a saw wave was when I was 8 but I do recall some music having a similar effect on me

now that I've been able to correlate a link between Hz/seizure and music/effect, I wonder if there is validity

and I don't know how to relate it to my seizure events - because I don't know what non-unconscious seizures are like, really
I know I've had seizures when I wake up to people telling me I've had a seizure
other than that, I don't really know, other than what I've tried to correlate from reading things online~
alas

 

[Rae1889]

Music is a trigger for me. Particularly things that are very electronic or auto-tuned. So in particular Brittany Spears after her Stronger album, where everything sounds robotic and her voice is very.... I dont even know the word for it. but it gets on my nerves and it causes seizures (of all types, though Im usually lucky to just have a sp or cp)

The goose bumps I get independantly. At random moments I get them on my head, or on one side of my body. and If i think really hard about them, I can trigger the goosebumps. There is another lady on here named Jan4You that also get goosebumps. We're bump buddies.

 

[mel239]

last week after missing meds I had an intense goosebump reaction that seemed to come from inside out-would peak and fade in 20 seconds and I would turn warm and normal then another would hit me-26 times in half hour and then it was gone.That night I was watching a new show and every scene was familiar-it was impossible to have seen it before and yet I knew I had for the whole hour every scene was like I had seen it prior but I couldnt remember the storyline or how it ended or what they said-just the visual part.The next morning I seemed to moodswing violently every 15 minutes and now Im fine.But that goosebump thing seemed to start the episode--SO WEIRD!!

 

[petero]

Music is a trigger for me. Particularly things that are very electronic or auto-tuned. So in particular Brittany Spears after her Stronger album, where everything sounds robotic and her voice is very.... I dont even know the word for it. but it gets on my nerves and it causes seizures (of all types, though Im usually lucky to just have a sp or cp)

The goose bumps I get independantly. At random moments I get them on my head, or on one side of my body. and If i think really hard about them, I can trigger the goosebumps. There is another lady on here named Jan4You that also get goosebumps. We're bump buddies.

bump buddies sounds interesting

this link plays an extreme example of the type of synthesizer tones I'm talking about
obviously these types of tones would be a hard sell in most music
but for the sake of example

 

[NeuroNotes]

Gosh, no way I could listen to that sound. Ouch. WARNING Not recommended for even 'normal' people. lol

Sean Paul song gave her seizures

"Certain songs really got to Stacey Gayle - and she had surgery to make them stop.

For four years, Gayle, 25, who has epilepsy had unpredictable epileptic seizures despite taking a regimen of medications. Then in 2006, she figured out that music, and specifically Sean Paul's chart topper "Temperature," could set off the attacks."

Read more: Source


Girl Suffers Seizures from Listening to Hannah Montana

Miley Cyrus, better known to some as Hannah Montana, is a hit sensation that targets to young audiences. She is known for her TV icon Hannah Montana, writes music, and has even acted in movies.

A 12-year-old girl from Florida was listening to one of Cyrus´ songs when she started having epileptic seizures. Upon treatment, Dr. Paul R. Carney discovered the girl had problems with baritone-type sounds such as dog barking.

Carney relates the seizure by saying "It´s like abnormal feedback off a microphone." Sometimes the human brain can have "glitches" in the system and pitches like the ones in one of Cyrus´ songs can trigger them. Source

 

[NeuroNotes]

Petox, I do believe your goosebumps may possibly be seizure related. Keep it up and you may experience more profound sensations that are clearly symptoms of seizures, but mistaken as a 'mystical' experience. Ever heard of Kundalini Rising?

The following are common manifestations of the risen Kundalini:

•Muscle twitches, cramps or spasms.

•Energy rushes or immense electricity circulating the body.

•Itching, vibrating, prickling, tingling, stinging or crawling sensations.

•Intense heat or cold.

•Involuntary bodily movements (occur more often during meditation, rest or sleep): jerking, tremors, shaking; feeling an inner force pushing one into postures or moving one's body in unusual ways.(May be misdiagnosed as epilepsy, restless legs syndrome (RLS).

•Alterations in eating and sleeping patterns.

•Episodes of extreme hyperactivity or, conversely, overwhelming fatigue.

•Intensified or diminished sexual desires.

•Headaches, pressures within the skull.

•Racing heartbeat, pains in the chest.

•Digestive system problems.

•Numbness or pain in the limbs (particularly the left foot and leg.

•Pains and blockages anywhere; often in the back and neck.

•Emotional outbursts; rapid mood shifts; seemingly unprovoked or excessive episodes of grief, fear, rage, depression.

•Spontaneous vocalizations (including laughing and weeping) -- are as unintentional and uncontrollable as hiccoughs.

•Hearing an inner sound or sounds, classically described as a flute, drum, waterfall, birds singing, bees buzzing but which may also sound like roaring, whooshing, or thunderous noises or like ringing in the ears.

•Mental confusion; difficulty concentrating.

•Altered states of consciousness: heightened awareness; spontaneous trance states; mystical experiences.

•Heat, strange activity, and/or blissful sensations in the head, particularly in the crown area.

•Ecstasy, bliss and intervals of tremendous joy, love, peace and compassion.

•Psychic experiences: extrasensory perception; out-of-body experiences; pastlife memories

•Increased creativity: new interests in self-expression and spiritual communication through music, art, poetry, etc.

•Intensified understanding and sensitivity: insight into one's own essence;

Source: http://www.kundalini-and-chakra.com/kundalini-symptoms.html

In other words - what some call a 'spiritual experience' or 'enlightenment' may actually be abnormal electrical activity, particularly in the temporal lobes. The lower the electrical threshold, the greater chance one has of experiencing this. At first, I bought into the trappings that this was a 'spiritual' experience and not seizure related, as is noted by the author above. In my opinion, one is playing with fire (no pun intended) when they attempt to practice Kundalini, but for many...it may happen by accident.

I experienced this quite by accident back in 2005, and my left hemisphere went completely quiet for several days. No mind chatter at all. Just silence and awareness (so to speak). The experience was profoundly life changing, and would eventually lead to an increase in seizure activity. However, at the time I experienced this, I didn't know I had a seizure disorder, as I had been misdiagnosed, or undiagnosed since I was 4. I was not on any medication at the time I had experience this, nor had I ever heard of the term Kundalini. It would be this very experience that led me down the path of discovering I had epilepsy.

It all started initially with goosebumps over a period of a few days. Sometimes while listening to music, sometimes by my thought processes. My right amygdala had been over active with worry and fear during this time as I had been going through a sort of 'spiritual' crisis, if you will. From what I've learn from researching this neurologically, my right amygdala had been over taxed with negative input from my environment, including thoughts. This over taxation apparently exhausted my right amygdala (negative emotions), and my left (positive emotions) amygdala then became over active. I had no fear.

A forensic look at the Buddha's transformation - Enlightenment and the Brain
As the left amygdala bursts into activity, the pressure is taken off of the one on the right, and the right hippocampus no longer needs to vent its activity. It remains busy. That enhances non-verbal cognitive processes at the expense of verbal cognitive ones.

The mind is 'silent'. "Suffering" is 'ended' as the left amygdala's positive emotions now predominate. Bliss, ecstasy, unconditional love, etc.

The story tells that he (Buddha) sat and looked at the morning star, venus. This suggests how he might have gotten hold of himself. By engaging a cognitive task. Putting all his attention into looking at a point of light, a common introspective task for meditators who experience inner points of light. I would suggest that his limbic system was very labile just then, and given it's contribution to the sense of self, it might have facilitated an interhemispheric intrusion; one that followed the cognitive context created shortly before, when he ended his episode with Mara. In the new context, a new sense of self emerged. One that wasn't based on language any longer. His non-linguistic sense of self became dominant. Source

Interhemispheric Intrusion

Suddenly, all was right with the world. Nothing had changed but my brain - my perception of my reality. I saw things I'd never noticed before, simply because my right hemisphere was not being dominated by my left. I even became aware, at one point, of my internal dialogs, which was quite bizarre. With no fear, I became a wee bit too trusting. Eventually, I found balance again. But during that time -- had I been approached by a robber, I may have invited him inside for a cup coffee. lol

I had no critical thinking skills. All lessons learned from the past flew out the window.

Here's a good example of (imo) someone (a so called 'spiritual' teacher - played by Nick Nolte) experiencing interhemispheric intrusion. Who was really the teacher in this scene? This scene was taken from the Movie "Peaceful Warrior", and got rave reviews in the spiritual community. It was even shown to children. In reality, they would have probably been killed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=<obj...ays" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>


For me personally, I thought I had 'seen the light', when in fact, I had experienced a strong seizure. :embarrassed: Now, when I get goosebumps, and it's not weather related, I know it's an aura.

IMHO, I'd stay away from music that might cause you to experience those goosebumps, just as a safety precaution. You are prone to seizure activity and have a low electrical threshold.

 

[petero]

Gosh, no way I could listen to that sound. Ouch. WARNING Not recommended for even 'normal' people. lol

Sean Paul song gave her seizures

"Certain songs really got to Stacey Gayle - and she had surgery to make them stop.

For four years, Gayle, 25, who has epilepsy had unpredictable epileptic seizures despite taking a regimen of medications. Then in 2006, she figured out that music, and specifically Sean Paul's chart topper "Temperature," could set off the attacks."

Read more: Source


Girl Suffers Seizures from Listening to Hannah Montana

Miley Cyrus, better known to some as Hannah Montana, is a hit sensation that targets to young audiences. She is known for her TV icon Hannah Montana, writes music, and has even acted in movies.

A 12-year-old girl from Florida was listening to one of Cyrus´ songs when she started having epileptic seizures. Upon treatment, Dr. Paul R. Carney discovered the girl had problems with baritone-type sounds such as dog barking.

Carney relates the seizure by saying "It´s like abnormal feedback off a microphone." Sometimes the human brain can have "glitches" in the system and pitches like the ones in one of Cyrus´ songs can trigger them. Source

I listened to the Ron Paul, er, Sean Paul song Temperature - and I noticed that a good bit of the lyrical parts had duplicate tracks of the singer singing/rapping the same thing, and then having both/several recordings of the same vocal playing at the same time

it gives songs a lot of depth in recordings - but it also creates phase shifts in sounds

and especially with vocals, which are many complex sounds put together, it could cause a lot of that phenomenon to occur

and with a lot of electronic based music, musicians often try to achieve that effect, because of that very fact - that it creates a depth - and it creates a lot of brain attention

that's what reverb is - it's like hearing a very rapid echo effect

I'm sure you know what I'm talking about

so I can see how an electrical system, processing one phenomenon, and then immediately processing the same/similar phenomenon could blow a fuse

I don't know if the brain works the same way - but it makes sense

 

[petero]

ya - the uh risen Kundalini characteristics sound like my day nearly every day to a degree

it occurred to me the other day, watching a science show about the origin of the universe from a singularity
and that there was a nudge of some sort, something that caused the universe to go boom and expand into what it is now
and uncertainty of its beginning (outside of a strictly religious interpretation) and the uncertainty of epilepsy, and their relation in terms of the appearance of an unseen energy force...
it makes me think

at times when I'm having these "seizures" (in quotations because I'm not sure if an EEG needs to be involved to use the term formally) it feels fantastic
it is a release - my body and the world melt away - and it is a matter of being tapped into some otherworldly energy

abnormalities are too often shunned
maybe epilepsy is the origin of intellectual evolution
a living organism can create tissue, but maybe seizures or something akin thereto is what initially activates these areas

I'm still getting used to hearing myself talk about these things this way and I'm a little afraid still of sounding like a nutjob
one reason I love reading about some of the things you find - that puts some credence into many of these complex and atypical ideas

 

[DayDreamer]

I participated in a family study for audiogenic epilepsy with Columbia University. They have published some papers talking about a mutated gene of LGI1:

•A form of epilepsy that we have named "autosomal dominant partial epilepsy with auditory features," is sometimes caused by a change in a gene on chromosome 10 called LGI1. People with this form of epilepsy frequently report changes in their hearing either before their grand mal seizures or as a separate seizure type. These symptoms include hearing sounds such as buzzing, ringing, or humming, or more rarely, hearing more complex sounds such as music, or having seizures precipitated by sounds.

About half of the families with this form of epilepsy have a mutation in the LGI1 gene. In the other half of families, the cause has not yet been identified -- so auditory symptoms sometimes occur in people who do not have this genetic form of epilepsy. Also, some of those who inherit a mutation in the LGI1 gene never develop epilepsy at all.

This gene could be testing for if desired, although I assume there are inumerable other forms of reflex epilepsies and as it states above this mutation may not be your explanation. It would not be bad to have electrodes attached to your skull while you listen to some known triggers.

I have asked my neurologist if there is any specific treatment for these seizures and as of yet none have been determined besides trying to stay away from the triggers. I seem to develop new reflexes. Now I cannot watch movie trailers.

For info on LGI1 testing:
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/724627

 

[NeuroNotes]

I have asked my neurologist if there is any specific treatment for these seizures and as of yet none have been determined besides trying to stay away from the triggers. I seem to develop new reflexes. Now I cannot watch movie trailers.

For info on LGI1 testing:
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/724627

Hi Daydreamer, thanks so much for the info about LGI1. Was unable to read the article in full as the link takes you to a membership page first, but I did look at a few other studies on this. Very interesting.

That is a bummer that you can't watch movie trailers anymore. I can be sensitive to the stobbing, and trailers pack in a lot of frames to get the message across in as little time as possible.

I do think it's pretty amazing that sound can affect us in so many ways. I think anyone has the potential of being affected in a 'negative' sense, but those with seizure disorders do seem to be more sensitive to sound in their environment, even when they are not consciously aware of it. Infrasound seems to be one of those triggers for me, and could also be a trigger for Petox as well.

Infrasound

Infrasound refers to extreme bass waves or vibrations, those with a frequency below the audibility range of the human ear (20 Hz to 22 kHz). Even though these waves can't be heard by us, they can be felt and have been shown to produce a range of effects in some people including anxiety, extreme sorrow, and chills. "Loud infrasound in the range of 0.5 to 10 Hz is sufficient to activate the vestibular, or balance system, in the inner ear." Psychologist Richard Wiseman of the University of Hertfordshire thinks that the odd sensations that people attribute to ghosts may be caused by infrasonic vibrations.* He is not alone.

In 1998, Vic Tandy, experimental officer and part-time lecturer in the school of international studies and law at Coventry University, and Dr. Tony Lawrence of the psychology department wrote a paper called "Ghosts in the Machine" for the Journal of the Society for Psychical Research. They cited infrasound as the cause of apparitions seen by staff at a so-called haunted laboratory in Warwick.

Several years earlier, Tandy was working late in the "haunted" Warwick laboratory when he saw a gray thing coming for him. "I felt the hairs rise on the back of my neck," he said. "It seemed to be between me and the door, so the only thing I could do was turn and face it." But the thing disappeared. However, it reappeared in a different form the next day when Tandy was doing some work on his fencing foil. "The handle was clamped in a vice on a workbench, yet the blade started vibrating like mad," he said. He wondered why the blade vibrated in one part of room but not in another. The explanation, he discovered, was that infrasound was coming from an extractor fan.

"When we finally switched it off, it was as if a huge weight was lifted," he said. "It makes me think that one of the applications of this ongoing research could be a link between infrasound and sick-building syndrome." When he measured the infrasound in the laboratory, the showing was 18.98 hertz--the exact frequency at which a human eyeball starts resonating. The sound waves made his eyeballs resonate and produced an optical illusion: He saw a figure that didn't exist.

Infrasonic waves can carry over long distances and are less susceptible to disturbance or interference than higher frequencies.

Infrasound may be produced by wind, by some types of earthquakes, by ocean waves, and by such things as avalanches, volcanoes, and meteors. Elephants have the ability to emit infrasound that can be detected at a distance of 2 km. Even tigers emit infrasound."

Source

 

[NeuroNotes]

I listened to the Ron Paul, er, Sean Paul song Temperature - and I noticed that a good bit of the lyrical parts had duplicate tracks of the singer singing/rapping the same thing, and then having both/several recordings of the same vocal playing at the same time

it gives songs a lot of depth in recordings - but it also creates phase shifts in sounds

and especially with vocals, which are many complex sounds put together, it could cause a lot of that phenomenon to occur

and with a lot of electronic based music, musicians often try to achieve that effect, because of that very fact - that it creates a depth - and it creates a lot of brain attention

Very interesting observation. =D Love it!

I found another article on Sean Paul's song.

SeizuresMusicophobia: When Your Favorite Song Gives You - Scientific America

To try to figure out how to treat Gayle, Ettinger and a colleague admitted her to an epilepsy monitoring unit in early 2007. The idea was to let her have a seizure. For four days, she wore a cap studded with electrodes so that doctors could observe her brain waves and videotape her.

They took her off her medications. No seizure came.

The doctors then tried keeping her awake. Nothing.

Gayle was tired of waiting; she had plans to fly to Jamaica the next day. So she told them to hand over her iPod. She put "Temperature" on repeat and drifted off to sleep.

She seized three times that night.

"The doctors were flabbergasted; they were speechless," says Gayle. "They couldn’t believe what I was saying was actually true."

The next day, Stacey went to JFK Airport on her way to the Caribbean. But as she approached her gate, she overheard Sean Paul blaring from an airport bar.

She never made it onto her flight.

Hahah, how many times have we heard "They couldn't believe what I was saying was actually true".

What's so sad about her story though, is that it was that specific song that was the beginning trigger which seemed to cause her to become sensitive to many more songs, then certain noise such as subway noise would cause her to seize. Interesting that you mentioned reverb. Just imagine the acoustics in a subway, airport, etc.

Macdonald Critchley first described musicogenic epilepsy—the technical term for seizures caused by music—in a 1937 paper, according to celebrated neurologist Oliver Sacks​'s latest book Musicophilia: Tales of Music and the Brain. Ashesh Mehta, a neurosurgeon at LIJ Epilepsy Center, calls the condition "exceedingly rare," noting that there are only 150 case studies ever reported, including the 11 Critchley wrote about. Patients have been known to react to everything from classical music to the Beatles and Pink Floyd​ to church bells played over a radio.

Source

I once had an out of body experience (indicative of TLE) while listening to Pink Floyd [ame="http://youtu.be/cJR2kz573cc"]"Welcome to the Machine"[/ame]. It never happened again with that song but it was a totally cool feeling, lol.

 

[petero]

Very interesting observation. =D Love it!

I found another article on Sean Paul's song.

Hahah, how many times have we heard "They couldn't believe what I was saying was actually true".

What's so sad about her story though, is that it was that specific song that was the beginning trigger which seemed to cause her to become sensitive to many more songs, then certain noise such as subway noise would cause her to seize. Interesting that you mentioned reverb. Just imagine the acoustics in a subway, airport, etc.

Source


because flashing lights, songs which are now highly digitized, loud noises, and things are often seizure triggers it led me to wonder if harmonics might have something to do with seizures
if you don't know what I mean, a decent example shows up on this video (yeah the dreaded video again...)
*warning turn volume down*

just pause the vid and use the scroll knob instead of pressing play
and scroll to 0:28, 0:31, 0:34, and at other high frequencies
the original VVVVVVVVV pattern suddenly becomes a _/\_/\_/\_ or ///// or something organized but not resembling the original VVVVVV
and this is because of the bit rate of the wave, the resolution of the oscillator, the oscillator processing speed, etc.

but these types of phenomena make me wonder if external repetitive stimuli like this could hit harmonic frequencies that stimulate the brain in ways to break down the seizure threshhold and cause seizures

the bit rate (rate of flashing lights, rate of sound reverb, layering, phasing effects...), the rate of mental processing - similar to the visual effect that takes place on the red oscillator wave - could find compatable harmonic frequencies in the brain

these mind altering phenomenon are already accessed, or attempted to be accessed, by meditation through repetition of chants, listening to chanting, spiritual dancing, drumming...
accessing Theta waves and whatnot

the stimuli don't necessarily have to be at a Theta wave ....


oh maaaaaaaan I'm rambling

well here's a wikipedia page about what I'm talking about

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doubletracking

double tracking...
when recording twice over, maybe there's a likelihood some audio Hz would be in and around the Theta wave range of 4-7 Hz, either through imprecise timing (which is the benefit of double tracking), being slightly out of tune, and or both

either through the lack of precision itsself or through a sudden harmonic

Hertz are Hertz aren't they?

I know it hurts after a seizure - maybe it Hertz prior to
:banana:


idk - I'm quite a bit tired - and I don't know how to write a thesis

 

[NeuroNotes]

ya - the uh risen Kundalini characteristics sound like my day nearly every day to a degree

it occurred to me the other day, watching a science show about the origin of the universe from a singularity
and that there was a nudge of some sort, something that caused the universe to go boom and expand into what it is now
and uncertainty of its beginning (outside of a strictly religious interpretation) and the uncertainty of epilepsy, and their relation in terms of the appearance of an unseen energy force...
it makes me think

This post is juicy, but tends to take people out of their comfort zone. I think it's interesting that it's been dubbed 'The Sacred Disease""The Sacred Disease" Hippocrates (c. 460-c. 377 BC).

"It is thus with regard to the disease called Sacred: it appears to me to be nowise more divine nor more sacred than other diseases, but has a natural cause from the originates like other affections."

About the Movie ---> Trailers http://sacreddisease.com/

A project designed to raise money for epilepsy research, and create awareness - The Sacred Disease is a feature documentary that covers the full spectrum of what it's like to live with epilepsy, by following the lives of three individuals. The film displays an intimate portrayal of the complexities and daily difficulties faced by people with the seizure disorder.

at times when I'm having these "seizures" (in quotations because I'm not sure if an EEG needs to be involved to use the term formally) it feels fantastic it is a release - my body and the world melt away - and it is a matter of being tapped into some otherworldly energy

abnormalities are too often shunned
maybe epilepsy is the origin of intellectual evolution
a living organism can create tissue, but maybe seizures or something akin thereto is what initially activates these areas

Indeed. I think it's because it is human nature to look for patterns, even in perfectly healthy people, especially when in distress, as the research has shown. I do try to keep that in perspective.

"A perfectly healthy human mind can trick itself into seeing things that are not there, and new research has exposed exactly the sort of conditions under which that happens. It turns out that the less control a person feels, the more likely they are to see patterns or make connections that don't exist. The good news is there is a way to fortify yourself against this sort of hard-wired self-deception." Source

As you are aware, disorders like TLE can cause a certain percentage of people to have intense religious experiences. [ame]http://youtu.be/v0WC9VPsAqg[/ame] BBC documentary (God on the Brain)

Mix a cocktail of culture, abnormal electrical activity, low electrical threshold, and our surrounding EM/GMA fields and the brain tube is illuminated with an image. Like Hippocrates stated, that such 'sacred' phenomena has a natural cause from the originates.

Let's take angels as an example. I've talked with many people who say they've seen angels. Of course, we as a culture, have our own interpretation of what an angel may look like, passed down from generation to generation. But where did that image of an angel originate? Are there really beings flying around with wings of feathers?

Let's just have some fun here. :bigsmile: elizzza you might get a kick out of this too.

This is totally a hypothesis, lol. What if people like us are much more prone to 'sensing' energy fields. What if some people can see them similar to how birds do, for instance. I wonder if people who have seizure disorders have more magnetite in their brain. The article you posted a while back showed that birds could see the earths magnetic field. We know that birds, etc, have magnetite as well.

For example, what if some can/could see visually or sense within, the energy field of something similar to a coronal mass ejection hitting the earth. I thought it was interesting how the EM fields glance of a sphere, i.e. earth.

What do you see?

Cropped and flipped

I'm still getting used to hearing myself talk about these things this way and I'm a little afraid still of sounding like a nutjob
one reason I love reading about some of the things you find - that puts some credence into many of these complex and atypical ideas

Well, welcome to the human race of planet earth. We've all gone mad, it seems. LOL

Btw, have you ever read any of Dr. Michael Persinger's work? I put together a video with a little snippit of his research. >Here is just a partial list of academic books and peer-reviewed journal publications on the subject of people with limbic lability and paranormal experiences. It's mind boggling how much research has been done in this area that most aren't even aware of. Some of the best research I've ever come across. According to Dr. Persinger, things could get ramped up with the massive onslaught of man-made electromagnetic fields interfacing with the GMA.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=<obj...ays" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>

 

[NeuroNotes]

Petox, I was in the middle of posting the my last post when you posted your last post. This is right up my ally, lol. Brainwave Entrainment! :woot:

Before I comment, I wanted to leave this video of the last CME we were hit with on Aug. 5. Notice how the magnetic fields looks like flapping wings?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=<obj...ays" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>

PS That tiny dot is the earth

 

[petero]

What do you see?

Cropped and flipped

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<


oh that is awesome
I was imagining two birds flying toward each other...
but yours is way better

I'm going to use that idea for an art piece if you don't mind
magnet field angels -

 

[NeuroNotes]

What do you see?

oh that is awesome
I was imagining two birds flying toward each other...
but yours is way better

I'm going to use that idea for an art piece if you don't mind
magnet field angels -

Ahh, that's a good one too. Now think about this...the illusion of the bird on top of the angel (2nd image) kinda looks like a descending dove?

Yes...I've been under a little stress lately, my dad has been visiting for 2 weeks. :roflmao:

 

[NeuroNotes]

because flashing lights, songs which are now highly digitized, loud noises, and things are often seizure triggers it led me to wonder if harmonics might have something to do with seizures
if you don't know what I mean, a decent example shows up on this video (yeah the dreaded video again...) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G71yKMtXDoA
*warning turn volume down*

BINGO

just pause the vid and use the scroll knob instead of pressing play
and scroll to 0:28, 0:31, 0:34, and at other high frequencies
the original VVVVVVVVV pattern suddenly becomes a _/\_/\_/\_ or ///// or something organized but not resembling the original VVVVVV
and this is because of the bit rate of the wave, the resolution of the oscillator, the oscillator processing speed, etc.

BINGO

but these types of phenomena make me wonder if external repetitive stimuli like this could hit harmonic frequencies that stimulate the brain in ways to break down the seizure threshhold and cause seizures

these mind altering phenomenon are already accessed, or attempted to be accessed, by meditation through repetition of chants, listening to chanting, spiritual dancing, drumming...
accessing Theta waves and whatnot

the stimuli don't necessarily have to be at a Theta wave ....

BINGO

oh maaaaaaaan I'm rambling

well here's a wikipedia page about what I'm talking about

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doubletracking

double tracking...
when recording twice over, maybe there's a likelihood some audio Hz would be in and around the Theta wave range of 4-7 Hz, either through imprecise timing (which is the benefit of double tracking), being slightly out of tune, and or both

BINGO

either through the lack of precision itsself or through a sudden harmonic

Hertz are Hertz aren't they?

BINGO

I know it hurts after a seizure - maybe it Hertz prior to
:banana:

Ummm, John Mellencamp "You make it Hertz so good" iano: That was so lame, I know. I'm tired too.


Well, I got a little nervous about making this post, which explains the delay, lol. I am going to post my website because I think you may really get into some of the data. It's rather comprehensive, always ever evolving, and incorporates a good bit of information about some of the subjects we have touched on.

The irony is, I am a brainwave entrainment engineer/technologist, and my business focuses on brain fitness research as well as potential environmental influences on the brain/body. I totally get what you're talking about, and it's so cool to be talking with somebody who knows something about this subject. Just awesome! A little background: I studied under Dave Siever, with Mind Alive out of Canada. He is a leading professional in the field of brainwave entrainment. Dave is also an engineer, researcher and university lecturer, plus manufactures a series of Audio-Visual Entrainment (AVE) devices. He works with the Faculty of Dentistry at the University of Alberta, and now brainwave entrainment is utilized for effective pain control during invasive dental procedures throughout Canada and Europe. AVE or BWE has been used as a non-drug approach to treating chronic pain, fibromyalgia, insomnia, PMS, PTSD and Attention Deficit Disorder as well as increasing creativity, improving sports and peak-performance. I'm not associated with Dave anymore, I just went through his certification program. I also don't incorporate his devises as I have my own protocol. There's a lot of scientific research posted on my site, and my home page has some of the very latest studies.

Another irony is that I got into entrainment to help me get well, (didn't know what was wrong) to achieve REM sleep, and for stress management. I did a little research and learned that utilizing a frequency known as sensorimotor rhythm (SMR), generally around 12 hz, could be beneficial. I also incorporated lots of theta. I would soon find out that I was not exactly the poster child for this therapy. I would get those nice tingly goosebumps you were talking about, lol. I do not incorporate brainwave entrainment on people with seizure disorders. Back when I first got into brainwave entrainment technology, I induced a few seizures using visual entrainment and didn't even know I was having seizures, lol. That was before I had been diagnosed. Talk about a wake-up call, eh? :roflmao:

This is why I never offer brainwave entrainment online or onsite (unlike most others), without a thorough evaluation, just to make sure they don't exhibit symptoms of a seizure disorder, serious depression, repressed traumatic memories, and have never sustained a traumatic brain injury. Plus, brainwave entrainment can easily tap into negative memories that people may have suppressed. I'm not a doctor.

I generally utilize isochronic tones, but binaural beats can be effective too.

www.corerejuvenation.com

http://corerejuvenation.com/Brainwave_Techniques.php

On this page you will see an example of a frequency following response, much like you were talking about.

http://corerejuvenation.com/FFR_-_Frequency_Sync.php

Edited to add:
This is not exactly the right place to be discussing brainwave entrainment from a promotional stance, and so we shouldn't, but I'm glad the subject came up. I hope people will take caution about using this technology should they be curious. Anyone can gain access to this and may not realize that precautions need to be taken seriously. Brainwave entrainment should never be used by those who have ever sustained a TBI, unless administered by a doctor.

Also, those who should not use brainwave entrainment aka AVE include: pregnant women and those who wear a pacemaker, or have had or are prone to seizures, are photosensitive or have epilepsy. Children under the age of 18 should always be examined by a physician for epilepsy or illnesses that may contribute to seizures prior to the use of brainwave entrainment sessions as they are more susceptible to seizures.

 

[petero]

some cool info no less

it's some interesting stuff to consider!