A personnel question aimed towards the Ladies :o)

[Deb12345]

Hello there,
I have only recently been diagnosed with Epilepsy (end of July 09). The thing is for many years I have always took two Evening Primrose tablets in the morning because my boobs can get very tender and sore. By reading the back of the tablet box and this site I have noticed that Evening Primrose can bring on a seizure. Even though I don’t think they do with me, I don’t want to risk taking them anymore. Since being diagnosed with Epilepsy, I have reduced them to just one a day, though having no benefits from taking it because I’m back to being very tender. The question I would like to ask is does anyone know of an alterative I could have to stop my boobs from getting very sore and tender? I would like to come off the Evening Primrose tablets completely. Thank you in advance.
Also do many of you have hormone related seizures i.e. I have noticed that I can get a big seizure (collapse and fit) when I think my body is ovulating? If so how can you get tested for this and how do you cope? Thank you all for your time. Much appreciated. Debbie

[Bernard]

Hi Debbie,

FYI: Borage Oil, Evening Primrose = GLA/Omega 6 fatty acid

I found this with a Google search:

... Herbs such as Calendula officinalis (Marigold) and Chamomile have excellent anti-inflammatory, anti-fungal and anti-bacterial properties that prevent infection and soothe and reduce pain and discomfort – acting as natural pain relievers. Other ingredients such as Calc. Flour, Vitamin E oil and Silica promote skin healing and reduce itchiness and discomfort.

http://www.nativeremedies.com/ailmen...e-breasts.html

[occb]

You can also try taking a multivitamin supplement that contains the B complex, zinc, Vitamin E, magnesium and Vitamin C.

Things to avoid which may increase breast pain:
caffeine, dairy, non-organic meats, and, for some people, soy products. Also, if you're on any medication that raises estrogen levels without raising progesterone levels, that can lead to breast pain as well.

I do not suffer from epilepsy, but I used to have fairly bad breast pain during PMS, which has disappeared since I removed dairy from my diet. Well, cow dairy -- I still eats goat's milk cheeses, but they don't cause me problems. I also have to monitor my caffeine intake during that time, because too much caffeine will give me a migraine. It's difficult, because that's the time of the month I feel most tired, and most in need of caffeine

[Deb12345]

Hello Bernard, thank you very much for your reply. Will have a look for those herbs. Just one question though, is Omega 6 fatty acids bad for people with epilepsy then? Thanks again.

Also, thank you occb for your reply. Will try anything out to stop the pain.

[Bernard]

... is Omega 6 fatty acids bad for people with epilepsy then? ...

It's a known seizure trigger for some. Others may be able to tolerate it fine, but if you read along the discussion I linked above, and this one on omega 3 oils, it shloud become clear what the problem is.

[paradise survivor]

Aloha Deb-I know all too well about the breast pain...oddly enough I found that ice packs help, or a really big bag of frozen corn

[RobinN]

You also might consider looking at foods that are high in Estrogen. If you are eating a lot of soy, that might be a culprit or at least add to PMS discomfort. Lowering these foods might bring you relief, over time.

[Loudmouth]

And in the meantime, try the old wives tale, it does actually work. Chilled cabbage leaves inside the bra. It sounds obscure but it relives breast pain from everything from the 'that time of the month' to mastitis when breastfeeding.

[RobinN]

Treatments for breast pain vary widely, again partially depending on your cultural setting. Women in England tend to use evening primrose oil or teas; in Italy they take vitamin E. The French use a cream to rub on their breasts, and in the United States we are told to grin and bear it. In Russia, I’m told, women put cabbage leaves on their breasts, then wrap themselves with warm cotton linen and go to bed for the night! All of the above may work for some women. Women in America are also offered birth control pills or a stronger male hormone, Danazol, to control the pain.

More suggestions on the website

http://www.womentowomen.com/breasthe...reastpain.aspx

[occb]

And in the meantime, try the old wives tale, it does actually work. Chilled cabbage leaves inside the bra. It sounds obscure but it relives breast pain from everything from the 'that time of the month' to mastitis when breastfeeding.

A friend of mine swore by this when she had mastitis from breastfeeding.

[Molly97]

You also might consider looking at foods that are high in Estrogen. If you are eating a lot of soy, that might be a culprit or at least add to PMS discomfort. Lowering these foods might bring you relief, over time.

This is from Dogtor J:

Estrogens in Food


Now, here is a chart from a Website showing foods high in estrogens and those that block estrogen. Keep in mind the difference between lignans and isoflavones. The use of high estrogen foods-especially those rich in glutamate- should be reconsidered in formulating the ultimate diet for the epileptic or those suffering from excitotoxin-related disorders as we know that estrogens are inflammatory and sensitize neurons to the action of glutamate (e.g. catamenial seizures, PMS).

I posted this chart mainly to help people see that the main "trouble foods"- gluten grains (wheat, barley, rye), dairy, and soy- are all in the estrogen-rich list. As you read more about what researchers are finding concerning the difference between lignans and isoflavones, you will see the war that is going on in our bodies between good and bad estrogens, paralleling the one raging between good and bad lectins.

Here's the site:

http://www.holisticonline.com/Remedi...d_estrogen.htm


Here's the chart:

Foods Containing Natural Estrogens

Note: Those is bold are also RICH in glutamate.

Alfalfa
Animal flesh
Anise seed
Apples
Baker's yeast
Barley
Beets
Carrots
Cherries
Chickpeas (garbanzo beans)
Clover
Cowpeas (black- eyed peas)
Cucumbers
Dairy Foods
Dates
Eggs
Eggplant
Fennel
Flaxseeds
Garlic
Hops
Licorice
Oats
Olive oil
Olives
Papaya
Parsley
Peas
Peppers
Plums
Pomegranates
Potatoes
Pumpkin
Red beans
Red clover
Rhubarb
Rice (relatively high)
Sage
Sesame seeds
Soybean sprouts
Soybeans
Split peas
Sunflower seeds
Tomatoes
Wheat
Yams


Estrogen Inhibiting Foods

If you are suffering from breast cancer, PMS, fibroids, ovarian cysts, and other situations that estrogen might exacerbate, the following estrogen inhibiting foods might be of interest to you.

Berries
Broccoli
Buckwheat
Cabbage
Citrus Foods
Corn
Figs
Fruits (except apples, cherries, dates, pomegranates)
Grapes
Green beans
Melons
Millet
Onions
Pears
Pineapples
Squashes
Tapioca
White rice
White flour Now, this is really cool! Why would wheat be on the list of estrogen-rich foods while white flour is on the list of estrogen-blocking foods? Doesn't make sense right? Actually, it DOES and illustrates a VERY important point. What do you get when you add water to white flour? Glue/ paste, right? What have I been saying about gluten again...it is "glue" and it does coat and stick to the villi of the duodenum. In this case, it coats the villi and blocks the absorption of the ESTROGENS in the food. Now, how cool is that?

When I saw this site a couple of years ago, I had another "revelation". Even the bad things have a purpose. In this case, the "glues" in the bad foods (gluten grains, dairy, and soy) don't just block the absorption of essential nutrients (and drugs). They also help block the bad things in these trouble foods, like the estrogens and goitrogens....antinutrients, like those found in soy. (Errrrrh.)

Whodathunkit? Yin and yang even applies to food.

http://dogtorj.tripod.com/id45.html

In the list of estrogen-rich foods, the ones that are high in glutamate as well are: animal flesh, barley, chickpeas, cowpeas, dairy foods, flaxseeds, oats, red beans, sesame seeds, soybeans, sunflower seeds and wheat.

[Molly97]

*Estrogens in Food- There are estrogens in foods which should be considered in formulating the ultimate diet, especially for women and those suffering from epilepsy, pain, and other excitotoxin-related disorders. We know that estrogens are naturally inflammatory and immunosuppressive and sensitive neurons to the action of glutamate (e.g. catamenial seizures, PMS). I will be expanding this section as time allows. Please also see the Appetizers section for more on this and other issues in women's health.

It is important for everyone to read about phytoestrogens and xenoestrogens. Phytoestrogens are basically those estrogens found in our diet from plant and animal sources. There are two main groups of phytoestrogens- isoflavones and lignans (with coumestans being a third). It is very interesting to make note of the differences in action and metabolism between the two main groups as well as their sources. Think naturally!!! (e.g. Lignans in fruits and veggies versus the isoflavones, like those found mainly in a legume buried under the ground and found originally in only one remote place on earth. Hint, hint.)

During breast cancer awareness month, I was giving out the term xenoestrogen to everyone who walked into my exam room, men and women alike. It is crucial for everyone to familiarize themselves with this term and the sources from which we derive these potentially harmful estrogenic compounds.

http://dogtorj.tripod.com/id45.html

[Deb12345]

Thank you all so much for your replies. Like I said earlier on in this thread I will try anything to relieve the horrible tenderness. Will have a good nose around the supermarkets for items mentioned above and will have a go at altering my diet a little i.e. cut down on dairy products, though my Mom isn't very keen on this idea. I may even go as far as trying the chilled cabbage leaves inside bra idea if it works. Thanks again. I hope you are all having a good / ok kind of weekend.
Best Wishes Debbie

[sicily726]

I'd like to know how hold you are before answering your query. About 8 years ago, when I was 40, I began to suffer extreme breast tenderness, dramatically increased seizure frequency and intensity, and other terrible problems around my periods. In my case, it was too MUCH estrogen, and too little progesterone. I began taking natural progesterone cream from days 12 through day 26 of my cycle (day 1 is the day you begin bleeding with your period) and, as a result, I've suffered NO breast tenderness and my seizures are dramatically reduced during those days I am on the cream. During those days I am off of the cream, I have seizures despite taking an anti-epileptic drug. So, in my case, estrogen caused my severe premenstrual symptoms and increase in seizure activity and progesterone cream eliminated all premenstrual symptoms (including mood swings, water retention, breast pain, etc) and reduced my seizures during those days I am on the cream.

[RobinN]

it has been suggested to me that my daughter might need the natural progesterone cream more than just the period of time you mention. We have tried it, and perhaps it did help. I might need to return to the therapy. However, I am working to get her body to do the job. Insulin and blood sugar issues can disrupt hormone levels.

We suggested TOO MUCH estrogen as well, in a few posts above. Foods can be high in estrogen, so monitoring that can help.

[sicily726]

Ya know what I find interesting respecting hormones, seizures and anti-epileptic drugs is this. Many, many years ago, when I had a brief encounter with Tegretol (brief because the side effects rendered me totally disabled--got rid of that drug quick!), the Tegretol made my periods completely stop. Since E is in my family and one of my sisters with E (who also has autism) was on Tegretol, too, I discussed this Tegretol stopping your periods stuff with my mom. She said Tegretol made my sister's periods stop, too, and that she began my l'il sis on evening primrose oil capsules, which made her periods come back. The Tegretol was effective at stopping my li'l sister's seizures, even with the evening primrose added to make her periods return.

Weird, eh?

It's my understanding that evening primrose oil helps your body to make estrogen; and that they recommend it to post-menopausal women (whose estrogen has dropped and whose periods have stopped) to stop hot flashes. Since too much estrogen makes me have more severe and more frequent seizures, I have little interest in ever taking the stuff--even after my periods cease (I'm still waiting . . . ) All I know is that there is definitely a connection, at least in my case, between my hormones and how much or how little seizure activity I have. Progesterone cream reduces my seizures during those days I'm on the stuff. I'm too scared to take it more than I already do, though (day 12 through day 26). I figure too much of even a good thing might not be okay.

[RobinN]

Is yours a cream?

[sicily726]

Yes. I take a natural progesterone cream made by a compounding pharmacist. I guess the progesterone comes from the wild Mexican yam plant. Vitamin B6 is also part of the mix. I rub it into my inner thighs, buttocks, on breasts, my belly, rotating where I rub it in each time.

[RobinN]

Rebecca has used the same type of cream. Only to be rubbed on her thigh. She gets her prescription from her neurologist, who has never done any homonal testing, or blood work in connection to this prescription. From my take on it, it is purely guess work, and based on pubmed articles, my requests and nothing more.

I too have used this, however stopped because I was paying out of pocket for the doctor and all the testing. Quite pricey. It made me feel really great, so I am going to find a way to have him monitor my hormones still. I have decided I am worth it. He is the doctor that suggested this might be a trigger of Rebecca's seizures. He is the one that tested her, and proved that her body was not ovulating and needed progesterone to counter the estrogen. He is the one that suggested that perhaps a very small dose needed to be extended thoughout the month, to support the surges of the other hormones. Her neurologist agreeded, and suggested that we extend it past the two week window. I have found it hard to monitor my teen, twice a day to make sure she is doing what is prescribed. It is time for her to be proactive, so I decided to let it rest for a few months. Thus... two seizures this TOM. For some reason she as protected the past four months that she did not use the progesterone, so I am a bit clueless.

Other than the fact that she had some nutritional challenges that would have caused quite an imbalance with her insulin levels, thus liver burden, and disregulation with hormones. Hadn't heard about Vit B6 as being part of the mix, but I will read a bit more about this wonder vitamin. I was giving her this vitamin in a B Complex, and this past month I ran out and did refill. Wondering if ....

[sicily726]

Robin, are you sure it is NATURAL progesterone cream and not a SYNTHETIC hormone in the cream? I mean, you said, "prescription"--which led me to believe it might be a synthetic hormone. The natural progesterone cream that I take does not require a prescription because it is NATURAL--not something some pharmaceutical company concocted in a laboratory somewhere where they use synthetic hormones (usually from baby horses or pigs). My progesterone comes from a plant, the wild Mexican yam plant. It is natural, coming from a plant and all; and, therefore, no prescription is required.

You are correct about the guesswork, though. You can purchase a saliva test online because saliva tests are superior to blood tests respecting detecting levels of various hormones. However, at different points in your cycle, the levels of the various hormones will vary. So, you'd have to do quite a few tests to determine where your hormones are at any given time.

Reading the book, "The Wisdom of Menopause" by Dr. Christiane Northrup, a Harvard Medical School educated woman doctor helped me a lot concerning hormones, the perimenopause, the menopause and the special diets, nutrients, supplements, including natural and bio-identical hormones (not synthetic hormones, which cause cancer),that may alleviate imbalances and symptoms of PMS, perimenopause, menopause, etc. I strongly recommend reading Dr. Northrup's book. She was pretty pissed, upon entering her own perimenopausal journey, how little was known about what was going on inside we women during this hormonally and otherwise turbulent time. She discovered stuff they don't teach in medical school, a lot of which was natural and nutritional, that can help alleviate the hormonal havock that can be wreaked upon women's lives during this time of transition.

Also, I discovered from other sources there is research being conducted respecting catamenial epilepsy where they use natural progesterone cream to control seizures. I think I found it either at epilepsy.com or the epilepsy foundation website. You might want to check that out, too.