Police and epilepsy

[Aidans family]

If I might, I want to ask how many of you have educated the police in your area about seizure conditions and behavior? The Epilepsy Foundation offes a dvd for a few bucks that is geared to that exact problem. As a Law Enforcement Officer and step father to someone with epilepsy I know that many of his actions during and after a seizure can be viewed by an officer as being resistant or combative. I personally purchased the DVD and gave it to my Sgt to show during roll call training and have recently heard that it may become a part of our academy training. I highly encourage all of you to contact your local depts and fill them in.

[McGill]

Since I work with them, I've been able to tell them quite a bit about it and about what causes me problems.

[Bernard]

My wife volunteers at the local VFD. She got a chance to meet most of the people in the local EMS dept before they had to meet her "on call". She has not talked directly to the local PD, but she has never had any post-ictal psychosis before either, so it hasn't been a personal concern.

[darcness]

This is a great topic. Each time my wife had a seizure and I called 911, the same police officer came to the scene. Both times he basically gave me the 3rd degree asking me about drug use, drinking, etc. So not only was I distraut about what had happened, but then I was even more upset by all the questioning. Especially the second time around when I KNEW it was a seizure definitely.

I think education is key when it comes to E. I think it's great that you have shared this and educated your co-workers/police department as well.

[McGill]

Bernard & darcness, fortunately for me, I was able to tell them what could cause the seizures, what they might look like and what to do if they will ever see anyone again, short of status epilepticus, (tonic-clonic seizures) which is a medical emergency.

[matchu]

excellent, can you let us know the title and where this can be purchased?

[moonchild1970]

Excelllent topic and idea!

Darcness- I am so sorry for your experience. Ignorence is NOT always bliss. Especially when we experience other people's ignorence. ...

[epileric]

I think you should talk to the local epilepsy foundation. The one here ordered instructional DVD's for the police & fire departments.

I can't remember who they ordered them from but I'm pretty sure they were from San Fancisco.

[MrsBoopster]

that is a good idea. The second and last time my baby had a seizure one of the men from the local FD that came here this time around was also here for her first seizure and the best thing was that he remembered my baby girl and knew what was wrong and took great care of my baby till the EMT's arrived.
I have never run into the police while she was having a seizure though, but I do think all FD, PD and others working with the public like this should be aware of epilepsy.

I need a instructional DVD for my kids school. I talked to them and they said they didn't know much about it. They only had one child there with seizures. The nurse is only there two days out of the week for 4 hours.

[McGill]

It's an old publication called "The Epilepsy Fact Book", but its terminology is probably very outdated. Most of what I described is basic first aid one can learn from St. John Ambulance Courses. The one thing I stress (and didn't mention above) is to Never try to open the mouth of the person who's having a seizure! You could possibly break one's teeth if you use something metal OR you could lose part of your own fingers if you try to put your hand in one's mouth during such a time. the strength is THAT strong!!"

[Brian-C]

If I might, I want to ask how many of you have educated the police in your area about seizure conditions and behavior? The Epilepsy Foundation offes a dvd for a few bucks that is geared to that exact problem. As a Law Enforcement Officer and step father to someone with epilepsy I know that many of his actions during and after a seizure can be viewed by an officer as being resistant or combative. I personally purchased the DVD and gave it to my Sgt to show during roll call training and have recently heard that it may become a part of our academy training. I highly encourage all of you to contact your local depts and fill them in.

I completely understand and appreciate that you're trying to be helpful but doesn't it seem a bit odd to you that in 2009, American police officers need to be clued in on epilepsy and the possibility that they very well may encounter someone who is having or has just had a seizure?

I mean, truck drivers train for just about every contingency. Even if it's unlikely. It's amazing to me that every police department doesn't already include this kind of thing in basic training.

And indeed, I often do worry about the possibility of police officers not knowing what is happening (or just not caring). I applaud your efforts. I'm just not sure why it's necessary.

[Belinda5000]

I definitely educated 2 cops in my area.
I'd had a seizure and after the seizue I was really disoriented didn't remember the way home and everyone I ask wouldn't help , but someone called because I was disoriented.
One cop said to me if you'd taken your meds you wouldn't of had a seizure. He got a 5 minute lecture on epilepsy so did his partner.
Everytime I have a seizure and they come I set them straight.
Belinda

[Aidans family]

I completely understand and appreciate that you're trying to be helpful but doesn't it seem a bit odd to you that in 2009, American police officers need to be clued in on epilepsy and the possibility that they very well may encounter someone who is having or has just had a seizure?

I mean, truck drivers train for just about every contingency. Even if it's unlikely. It's amazing to me that every police department doesn't already include this kind of thing in basic training.

And indeed, I often do worry about the possibility of police officers not knowing what is happening (or just not caring). I applaud your efforts. I'm just not sure why it's necessary.

The problem is that Officers deal with such a wide variety of situations it is hard to train for everything. Police Officers undergo months of training on as much as possible but they can't train for everything. Sometimes it takes an Officer that has previous knowledge, like myself, or an incident to happen before an officer deals with it and learns from his experiences. I know with my dept we are trained in just basic first aid and it just talks about seizures very generally and briefly.

[ADK]

For the online ADA video:

Police Response to People with Disabilities (Seizures):

http://www.ada.gov/videogallery.htm#Anchor-Dial-47492

So the DOJ has training materials online. How many police officers have watched them? I am sure the State Police has watched them, but what about your local PD?

In my experience... I believe it is easier for the police to make an arrest, get you in front of a judge and let the courts make a determination about your behavior.

How many have been incarcerated for seizure related behavior and not received your prescribed anti-epileptic drug's?

For instance...Will your local correctional facility allow a person to take their own med's or do they have to be prescribed by a jail physician that does not know you? Most noticably, in NY Jail physicians are not available on the weekends.

The DOJ video is good but people with E have a long way to go to change the criminal justice system and to save their own lives and dignity.

[Aidans family]

Why are you so sure that the State Police have seen it but not locals? MAyb ein NJ where the State Police actually do more, but in areas like AL they mainly deal with the interstates. I haven't looked at that DOJ video but I'll check it out. If it's decent I'll send it to our training staff.

And no. It's not easier for an officer to make an arrest and let the courts deal with it. Because we have to go to the courts and explain why we made that arrest. Not wanting to make a determination is not a good explaination. Believe it or not, cops aren't trying to put everybody in jail.

[ADK]

Aidans Family,

I have been arrested for seizure related behavior! In fact a Human Rights complaint has been filed because of the arrests. Although all charges have been dismissed on the law and in the interest of justice it was quite embarrasing.

The police admitted their mistakes in their reply briefs to the DOJ and DHR.

In fact, The NYSP work in rural areas and not just on interstates. Our local Sheriff and local PD didn't have a clue about E unless someone was 'convulsing.' NYSP have responded to other emergencies about me and understand E.

I had worked for criminal defense attorneys for over 10 years before being diagnosed.

The online video was mentioned in the reply briefs in the DHR complaint and many were unaware about it. The DOJ materials about E have been available for many years.

Quite frankly, The E foundation in NY has even failed to educate police north of the NY Thruway. They allege they don't have the resources.

You may be a very good person for what you are trying to do and I commend you for what you are trying to do. I do not hate police or believe that they are all rotten. I just believe that many don't understand E or do not want to understand. Just sometimes it takes the DOJ or DHR to make them understand.

[greatfulgirl]

I recently did an interview with the local cheif of police here on fort drum and was told when I asked if they were aware of people with epilepsy and he stated that it was more likely that a veteran officer notice someone with epilepsy than one of the yonger offecers. they do not recive throe medical training and epilepsy is told to them but they just do not notice because of the lack of training in dealing with epileptics. I did this interview because my major is homeland security and none of the other agencies would let me interview any one. I was also told that the likely hood of me gaining a career is very slim because of the seizures. THAT IS DISCOURIGING AND HURTFUL. They need to be educated more.

[tam bam]

Hi,

I suffer from frontal lobe epilepsy and it brings about weird complex partial seizures that if not explained to others it can be appear to be odd at times. I am so glad that someone brought this topic up. I have been to the ER before and have been accused of being on drugs before when I was really having seizures or I have been to the doctor before and have been accused of looking for drugs and sat there having a seizure in front of the doctor. My seizures are complex partial seizures and while they can generalize they do not all the time and when people automatically think seizures they think of the convulsive types. Well people need to be educated on seizures and that not all seizures do not look the same.

I have often times wondered that if some of my bizarre seizure symtoms will land me in jail myself because I can appear to be in a drunken stupor. I can also act crazy and start to throw things for no reason and yell profanities and what not. It is not pretty. I am not controled on meds at this time (I do take meds but they do not help much) and try to limit myself from going out into public but I have to work and shop sometime so I am sure it will happen someday.

I do think it is an excellent idea to educate the police and fire departments on this topic that seizures can cause odd behavior in people that just in not the stereotypical behavior that most people would think of like convulsions, biting tongue, wetting self etc. (Not everyone does this type of behavior).

My cousin is married to the Assistant Fire Chief in my home town and over Christmas I am going to talk to him about educating the first responders in the unsual epliepsy cases and see what he thinks. If I take this to my local police department no one would listen because they are idiots in this town. I know my cousin will listen. He has a lot of pull in my town. I hope to get something happening. We will see. I think this is a great idea!

tam bam

[Ruth]

If I might, I want to ask how many of you have educated the police in your area about seizure conditions and behavior? The Epilepsy Foundation offes a dvd for a few bucks that is geared to that exact problem. I personally purchased the DVD and gave it to my Sgt to show during roll call training and have recently heard that it may become a part of our academy training. I highly encourage all of you to contact your local depts and fill them in.

Thank you Aidans family, in my town the police, fire department and EMT's are educated. In some of my seizures, it is the hospital that is not educated. Would you please give me a link to get the DVD? My doctors need to be educated.

Glad to meet you. Welcome to the forum. Is your whole family included in our forum? That would be great. My husband and son know about the forum, but they will not join. They could learn a lot.

[greatfulgirl]

I am currently a criminal justice major and I had to conduct an interview with the chief of police and spoke to him about educating his fellow officers about this medical condition. I my self have seizures and it was terrible to hear that they had little medical training considering that they are first responders and you never know what you will be responding to.