ketogenic diet and exercise

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hi,

I am thinking about starting a ketogenic diet. Probably gonna be tough, bcuz i love fruit and baked goods and grain cereals. However, i also love bacon, and any diet where i can eat bacon all day long sounds like a good one.

My question is about exercise. Does cardiovascular exercise like running or rowing have any effects particular on fat consumption? I mean, if i'm not consuming sugars, and only enough proteins to function properly, not excess proteins which will turn into sugars, then ... does running and so on burn up the energy stored in fat cells and therefore help the brain? Is it important to wait until the body enters "ketosis"?

As you see, this is new to me. I'm accustomed to exercising alot, in the past i used to run several miles every week, on top of weight training. I don't have a lot of fat on me.

I guess it's hard to formulate my specific questions. I'm just looking for advice.

thanks:ponder:
 

epileric

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If you do try the ketogenic diet make sure you do it under the supervision of someone medically trained because you can cause harm.

The diet is known to be much more effective on younger children than adults though.
The ketogenic diet is almost never prescribed to adults, who generally make their own food choices and often have difficulty complying with the diet’s strict guidelines.
The Modified Atkins Diet is much more appropriate for adults.
A modified version of a popular high-protein, low-carbohydrate diet can significantly cut the number of seizures in adults with epilepsy, a study led by Johns Hopkins researchers suggests.
Modified Atkins Diet Can Cut Epileptic Seizures in Adults
 
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KarenB

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What Epileric says is true. You should especially be careful with a Ketogenic type diet if taking either Topomax or Zonegran, as these 2 drugs can cause kidney stones and acidosis, which is also a potential side effect of the Ketogenic diet. So...your CO2 levels have to be monitored, and perhaps a buffer (like baking soda or potassium citrate) added to bring body into right balance.

Also extremely important to drink lots of water to avoid the above serious problems.

When adults start the Atkins diet (for weight loss), the general advice is not to add exercise in for 2 weeks. About 3 days in, you get what's called the "Atkins Flu" -- where you feel really wasted for about 24 hours as your body adjusts from burning glucose to burning fat for energy.

Our son (now 8 y o) has been on the Ketogenic diet for about 1 1/2 years. He was in the hospital for the first 3 days, but once he got out, he was able to resume normal PE class and other athletic activities.

The ketogenic diet is actually more effective if you are leaner. I'm not sure what effect intense exercise will have on your ketone levels, but I would think it would tend to increase them.

And...sorry, but you don't get to eat bacon all day long, because, as you've already noted, the Ketogenic is "adequate protein" -- not high protein.

A typical meal plan might look like this:

Breakfast: omelet made with heavy cream, and your choice of veggies (i.e. mushrooms, spinach, zucchini, etc.) cooked in about 1 TB of butter or canola or olive oil. You might be able to work in a strip or two of bacon if you limit your egg to 1 (not sure what protein requirements would be for you)

Lunch: a big salad with whatever greens you like and whatever raw veggies you like, topped with avocado (Haas avocado has a perfect 4:1 ratio), cheese, bacon bits (yeah -- here you get some) and a high fat, low carb salad dressing (like original Ranch, or Blue Cheese, or a Vinaigrette, or something without sugar)

Supper: a modest serving of chicken or beef or fish or pork (depending on your protein requiremets) along with a veggie and then you've got to work in some way of getting fat into the meal. I often use a hollandaise type sauce, where I mix real mayo in with butter and a little lemon juice, and then can go over the veggies.
 

KarenB

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Just a few other thoughts:

You mentioned a love of fruit -- fruit can be included (in modest amounts) in the Keto diet -- especially fruit lower in carbs, such as star fruit, strawberries, blackberries, raspberries.

Tomatoes and avocadoes are excellent for the diet.

Watermelon, cantaloupe and apples are ok if on a lower ratio.

Bananas and mangoes will probably not be consumed.

Baked goods -- you can make muffins, cookies, etc. using flaxseed meal or ground nuts instead of flour, and omitting the sugar (using a safe sweetener instead). Check out the Charlie Foundation website for recipes and also they have a list of low carb products, including sweeteners.

Grain cereals ....probably not..

However, you may not have to go on a really strict Keto diet. You might want to try a sort of modified dietary approach that would be easier to live with.

Suggestions:
1) Lower daily glycemic load to 80 or lower. This can be done by eliminating simple sugars and some carbohydrates.
2) Lower carbohydrate level to around 50 per meal. And make the carbs you get count -- complex carbs -- whole grains, legumes, nuts, veggies, fruit, rather than simple carbs.
3) Increase fat intake to make up for calories lost from reduced carbs, but try to use healthier fats -- olive oil, canola oil, nuts, olives, avocadoes, etc.
4) May also want to try removing gluten from diet -- this (and sugar) seems to cause seizures for a lot of people
5) MSG is in a lot of processed foods -- sausage, soups, etc. -- and some find that and various preservatives to be seizure triggers.
6) Be careful about too much artificial sweeteners. We try to stick with one packet per day, even though we use Stevia, which is considered relatively "safe."

We use the Ketocalculator to plan our son's meals, but for myself, I use this website to calculate carb level and estimated glycemic level of foods
http://nutritiondata.self.com/

If you are taking a nutritional approach to managing seizures, may also want to think about supplements such as vitamins, magnesium, omega 3 fish oil, etc.
 

Dutch mom

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A keto diet for adults is very difficult because protein amounts per meal are different from childeren, usually the diet is more difficult to calculate end cook as children get older, that's why starting the diet on a young age is prefered and why it is usually not prescirbed to adults.
On a 'real' keto diet (classical version ratio 4:1) you consume 4x as many fats per meal as carbs + protein together and calories are resticted, each meal contains a stricvktly calculated amount of calories, fats, carbs and proteins. On the mct diet you can eat more carbs but the mct procucts usually taste bad and are not easy to combine in your meals. And they are very expensive when your health insurance doensn't pay for them.
Modified Atkins (not just normal Atkins which contains too many proteins) is sufficient to reach a state of ketosis and can show whether the diet has effect on your seizures. If there is no effect, the chance the keto diet works is very small.
Make sure to consult an experienced keto dietitian when you consider a keto diet, it is no diet to do without a dietitian and you will need medical check ups each 6 months.
Last but not least: a ketogenic diet can cause cardiological problems and heart failure + increased cholesterol levels and kidney stones, especially in adults!
http://www.livestrong.com/article/536384-ketogenic-diet-and-heart-failure/
 

Shona

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Hi New Shoulder

Before you try the diet (which I am assuming because it might control your seizures), first try a preservative, colouring free diet.

Someone with epilepsy should not have any artificial sweetner, sacchrin (which is found in Lamictal and causes me to have seizures).

Keep a seizure and food diary, read labels and know whats in your body before you try the diet, the diet is tough and may not be healthy. I am still learning what preservatives affect me which is tough because most things have heaps of preservatives. I make my own home made dips, cut out bread as that has preservatives (even fresh baked).
 

deeds

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Gluten and almost Seizure Free

I decided to do a cleanse under the supervision of a naturopath. It was supposed to be a two week ordeal of no wheat, no soy,no dairy, no corn, no caffeine, no nightshade vegetables, the only sweetener I used was maple syrup, I believe organic honey was allowed.
All produce had to be Organic and any meat or fish had to be antibiotic and hormone free.
I thought I would have to spend a lot of time searching for these products but everything was available at my local supermarket.
Well, now it is January and instead of going off the cleanse I decided to stay on it. I do not drink alcohol or coffee anyway but I have noticed many changes.
I do not have a great appetite but I had to promise myself that I would eat 3 meals a day and have 2 snacks inbetween.
First of all, I never feel bloated and I do remain on my cocktail of meds but the percentage of reduction in seizures is staggering.
It is a huge commitment to rid ones life of Gluten but in Chapter 14 of the best seller Wheat Belly gluten is listed as a potential trigger to the sensitive brain..... It is amazing where gluten is lurking, cosmetics, many a sauce or dressing and on and on...... Reading labels takes up a lot of time but it is so worth it.
I find that cooking and eating at home is the best way to go. I have had very few seizures.
The only thing that I think could be problematic is you are either doing it 100% or not at all.
There is enough good food to consume and I find that prep is key.
I feel great. There is rice pasta that is just as good as the ones with wheat. I have reintroduced dairy but only in the form of goat milk cheese. I am using non dairy milks, either almond, brown rice basmati, hemp or coconut..... The list goes on.
Most of all........ Happy brain, happy new year!
 

Nakamova

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Hope the dietary changes continue to help. Keep us posted!
 

KarenB

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deeds -- that sounds like a good plan, and glad it's working for you! Our dietician always recommends that her patients try a gluten free/sugar free diet before initiating the Ketogenic diet, because sometimes just taking out those 2 food items can do the trick for seizure control, without having to go on the much stricter Keto diet.

And avoiding processed foods and going organic is always a great plan. We have a supermarket near us that only sells organic fruit, veggies and meats (part of the Thai King's project), and I do about 90% of my grocery shopping there. The price tag is a bit higher, but I figure that the reduced hospital and doctor bills make it worthwhile.

Our Jon is basically following the same food plan except he does get cream and a little butter (both are low in lactose, which seems problematic for many). We had already cut out all sugar and all grains for the Keto diet, and then eliminated nightshade veggies a couple months ago because the eggplant was triggering seizures, and the peppers and tomatoes seemed to cause diarrhea.
 
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