Pseudoseizures...

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I just came across something called "pseudoseizures" which are apparently seizure-like reactions to psychological triggers. I wonder if anyone has had these? I know I tend to have seizures in socially stressful situations, so I wonder if there's something there.

Noted there's some blood test that can tell them apart. But what are they? Do they appear just like real seizures?
 
My daughter was misdiagnosed with this a year ago. I know them well. Very very difficult for observers to tell them apart. Just don't ever let them tell you that the EEG proves you don't have a true seizure disorder.

My thought on this though. Nutrition still can play a part in how the body reacts to stress. It can play a part in how the brain functions. It can help in many neurological disorders. So my only suggestion is to really look at this aspect of your life, and clean up where you have perhaps been sloppy (sorry I am sloppy so I presume everyone is) and move forward from there. It gives you an over all feeling of wellbeing that can only help. IMO
 
I don't belive in them and this is why. If you are nervous, for example, you breathe faster. This changes your heart rate and the blood flow through your brain. The change in brain metabolism can trigger a seizure or seizure like spells. This can happen as a result of many things, too high a level of homocysteine, an electrolyte imbalance. Calling the spells pseudoseizures is to blame the victim for a reaction to an unknown stimulus. The spells are real, and it could be dangerous to tell someone it is just in her or his head. Sometimes, as in cases where people faint or seize at the sight of blood, the problem is a dysregulation of the vagal nerve, not a psychological problem at all. This doesn't negate the fact that we do have the ability to alter our behavior to influence our nervous system in ways that enable us to control our seizures too. I just rail at inventing "psychological" myths about everyday problems with our bodies. It is crazy making and disease mongering. Robin is right about the EEG, it shows patterns of brain wave activity but cannot prove or disprove seizure disorders.
 
Yeah Zoe!!! :banana: You say it so well.
They are both real.
 
My mom has these pseudoseizures and I have witnessed them first hand for 3 years. They look just like the seizures I have. I have begged her to get a 2nd opinion because her neuro says "It's just stress from her job & unresolved childhood issues" and put her on Topamax and Atavan and sent her to a psycatrist(sp?) She has been to the ER by ambulance 4 times this month b/c she has back to back seizures lasting over 15 minutes (isn't that what you call status or something?) and they run some tests, give her a shot of something and send her on her way. She is currently on medical leave and talking to her shrink and still having seizures. I refuse to believe "its in her head" but she refuses to believe she has epilepsy.
 
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So take the darn word Epilepsy out of the vocabulary if necessary, and call them seizures.
She is unwell, and obviously the meds are doing her no good. Getting therapy is an excellent add on IMO, but she needs further testing.

Something is wrong in her system if stress from doing work can cause a seizure. It needs medical attention, not a pat on the back, "here's your prescription". :taz:

I just posted a really interesting article, that is worth reading... again IMO
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0FDN/is_1_12/ai_n19170695/print
 
Yes that is an interesting article Bernard.
I am curious though how can vasovagal syncope be confused with a seizure? Would that just be a certain type of seizure that does not have convulsions? What about the postictal state. Isn't that fairly unique to seizures?
 
My mom has these pseudoseizures and I have witnessed them first hand for 3 years. They look just like the seizures I have. I have begged her to get a 2nd opinion because her neuro says "It's just stress from her job & unresolved childhood issues" and put her on Topamax and Atavan and sent her to a psycatrist(sp?) She has been to the ER by ambulance 4 times this month b/c she has back to back seizures lasting over 15 minutes (isn't that what you call status or something?) and they run some tests, give her a shot of something and send her on her way. She is currently on medical leave and talking to her shrink and still having seizures. I refuse to believe "its in her head" but she refuses to believe she has epilepsy.

She may be having seizures for many reasons. Was she ever evaluated for diabetes? Something is happening when she has them and whatever it is may well be influencing her mental states. At least one of the drugs she is taking could be a problem. Topamax can cause metabolic acidosis and may be making your mother's symptoms worse or causing some of the symptoms you describe.
Metabolic acidosis can cause seizures. She may want to contact the Alternative Mental Health Group, Safe Harbor, and see if they can help her locate a physician and\or psychiatrist for her in your area who will look at her medication. Maybe if you keep encouraging her to seek a second opinion, neurological and psyciatric she will do so. Sounds like she is getting really shoddy care.
She might want to find another physician or hospital and be evaluated for metabolic acidosis. Here's a link to info on Topamax, that will give you and your mom an idea of the symptoms:

TOPAMAX* (topiramate) use is associated with Metabolic AcidosisUse of TOPAMAX is associated with metabolic acidosis in both adults and children with doses as low as 50 mg/day. Symptoms include hyperventilation, fatigue ...
http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/dhp-mps/medeff/advisories-avis/prof/2004/topamax_3_hpc-cps_e.html

Link to Safe Harbor:
http://www.alternativementalhealth.com/
 
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Yes that is an interesting article Bernard.
I am curious though how can vasovagal syncope be confused with a seizure? Would that just be a certain type of seizure that does not have convulsions? What about the postictal state. Isn't that fairly unique to seizures?

Robin,
Is it becoming obvious how arbitrary the diagnoses are? Different docs will yield different diagnoses. EEGs can be indistingusihable for syncope and epilepsy. The seizure process can trigger syncope and vice versa. And keep in mind that 70% of the time seizures are diagnosed as idiopathic (no known cause) and it is up to the person with seizures to do the research to find the cause and learn how to manage the seizures or overcome them. Once the label is applied the focus shifts from finding a cause to suppressing the seizures, not finding and addressing their causes. The EEG is not a diagnositc final word, just one technique for determining if someone has seizures. Ultimately, the diagnosis is an opinion, a judgement call. So one doc may tell you seizures, another pseudoseizures, another syncope, another, panic attacks. Obviously, there is no "Truth in Labelling" when it comes to epilepsy. But whatever the label, there's a designer drug for it.
 
Zoe-
You write what my heart and brain know, but was unable to put into words. I thank you.
 
Robin,
I'm appreciating all you do to add the the "Alternative Approaches encyclopedia". This is truly team work!
 
Thanks for the links Zoe. I don't think she's ever been tested for diabetes either. I will let her know to get tested and give her the other info. She has also changed neuros and the new one changed her from Topamax to Lamictal.
 
Hi Jk,
I hope the change will get your mom some better treatment. Thanks for the update!
 
It probably doesn't matter what you label them. If they are a problem, they are a problem. I, for one, don't like to tell people I am "epileptic", scares them off. Instead I say I have a problem with siezures, or even better, a problem with spells and brainstorms.

I wanted to go back to the bit about breathing faster causing spells. I have noted in the past that approximately half my seizures occur after working out, climbing up a mountain, riding a bike to the top of a long hill.

I remember a game I used to play as an adolescent when I'd breathe ten breaths as fast as I could, then hold my breath trying to blow out with my lips closed. This would knock me out and I got a thrill from doing it; I'd wake up a moment later feeling disoriented wondering where I was.

It makes sense that if you are stressed, breathing rapidly, your seizure threshold is likely to drop. so deep breathing when you are in crisis may be a good thing to do.
 
I would think so too John. I know I use the technique when my heart is racing and I just want to center my self. Get grounded so to speak.

Times haven't changed much. There was a game recently that the teens were playing, even under the noses of the school staff. The had someone hold them while holding their breath to pass out. Glad it seems to have moved on to other stupid pranks.

Not that I understand how low oxygen levels can cause seizures, but have you ever been placed on a treadmill test? Seems like it might be a good thing to monitor your heart. IMO
 
I was misdiagnosed with psuedoseizures (non epileptic seizures) so I know a lot about them. I do know of someone who does have NES. Subconciously, he is trying to get attention with these spells. I do know that an EEG CANNOT always tell a difference between epileptic and non epileptic seizures, as was the case for me. Ive also know that you can have both non epis and epileptic seizures. I think 25% of people with epileptic seizures have both...
 
Interesting Reading

I was misdiagnosed with psuedoseizures (non epileptic seizures) so I know a lot about them.

I do know that an EEG CANNOT always tell a difference between epileptic and non epileptic seizures, as was the case for me. Ive also know that you can have both non epis and epileptic seizures.

Yes you're correct that it is possible for a
person to have both Epileptic Seizures and
Non-Epileptic Seizures.

There is also a Frontal Lobe Epilepsy which
does not show up on EEG:


Frontal Lobe Epilepsy from eMed


This website is LOADED with information - must visit to see!

================================

However recent findings have found some
new latest findings:

Idiopathic nocturnal frontal lobe epilepsy--an unusual epilepsy syndrome

ABSTRACT
[Article in Hungarian]
2007 Sep 30;60(9-10):370-9.

Halász P, Szucs A, Kelemen A.

Országos Pszichiátriai és Neurológiai Intézet, Epilepszia Centrum, Budapest.

This paper provides an overview of the development of conceptions about nocturnal frontal lobe epilepsy syndrome and describes the electro-clinical characteristics, the identity of the genetic and sporadic variant, and the relationship of the EEG and clinical signs with NREM sleep specific features. The differential diagnostic difficulties and open questions on the pathomechanism are emphasized especially in relation with the lack of epileptiform EEG signs, circumsribed seizure onset zone and cognitive deficits. The relationship of frontal automatisms and NREM parasomnias are also discussed in relation of the place of nocturnal frontal lobe epilepsy among other epilepsies.

PMID: 17987731 [PubMed - in process]



===================================

An Old Journal but an interesting one:


nocturnal frontal lobe epilepsy


ABSTRACT

Autosomal dominant nocturnal frontal lobe epilepsy. A video-polysomnographic and genetic appraisal of 40 patients and delineation of the epileptic syndrome.

Oldani A, Zucconi M, Asselta R, Modugno M, Bonati MT, Dalprà L, Malcovati M, Tenchini ML, Smirne S, Ferini-Strambi L.

Sleep Disorders Centre, University of Milan, School of Medicine, Istituto Scientifico H. San Raffaele, Italy.

A number of clinical and aetiological studies have been performed, during the last 30 years, on patients with abnormal nocturnal motor and behavioural phenomena. The aetiological conclusions of these studies were often conflicting, suggesting either an epileptic or a non-epileptic origin. Among the clinical characteristics of these patients, the familial clustering was one thoroughly accepted. A nocturnal familial form of frontal lobe epilepsy (autosomal dominant nocturnal frontal lobe epilepsy, ADNFLE), often misdiagnosed as parasomnia, has been recently described in some families. In one large Australian kindred, a missense mutation in the second transmembrane domain of the neuronal nicotinic acetylcholine receptor alpha 4 subunit (CHRNA4) gene, located on chromosome 20 q13.2-13.3, has been reported to be associated with nocturnal frontal lobe epilepsy. We performed an extensive clinical and video-polysomnographic study in 40 patients complaining of repeated abnormal nocturnal motor and/or behavioural phenomena, from 30 unrelated Italian families. Thirty-eight patients had an electroclinical picture strongly suggesting the diagnosis of ADNFLE. They had a wide clinical spectrum, ranging from nocturnal enuresis to sleep-related violent behaviour, thus including all the main features of the so-called 'typical' parasomnias. The video-polysomnographic recording confirmed the wide spectrum of abnormal manifestations, including sudden awakenings with dystonic/ dyskinetic movements (in 42.1% of patients), complex behaviours (13.2%) and sleep-related violent behaviour (5.3%). The EEG findings showed ictal epileptiform abnormalities predominantly over frontal areas in 31.6% of patients. In another 47.4% of patients the EEG showed ictal rhythmic slow activity over anterior areas. Only 18.4% of the patients had already received a correct diagnosis of epilepsy. In 73.3% of the patients treated with anti-epileptic drugs the seizures were readily controlled. Pedigree analysis on 28 of the families was consistent with autosomal dominant transmission with reduced penetrance (81%). DNAs from 20 representative affected individuals were sequenced in order to check for the presence of the missense mutation in the CHRNA4 gene found in the Australian kindred affected by ADNFLE. Nucleotide sequence analysis did not reveal the presence of this mutation, but it did confirm the presence of two other base substitutions, not leading to amino acid changes. These two intragenic polymorphisms, together with a closely linked restriction fragment length polymorphism at the D20S20 locus, have been used for linkage analysis of ADNFLE to the terminal region of the long arm of chromosome 20 in five compliant families. The results allowed us to exclude linkage of ADNFLE to this chromosomal region in these families, thus confirming the locus heterogeneity of the disorder. Large and full video-polysomnographical studies are of the utmost importance in order to clarify the real prevalence of both nocturnal frontal lobe epilepsy and parasomnias, and to provide a correct therapy.

PMID: 9549500 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


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