Could i have epilepsy during sleep?

[nibiru2012]

Hi.

I have sleep apnea (non compliant yet), but i also jump in my sleep all night.

Because this doesn´t seem to be a common sleep apnea symptom, my sleep doctor wants me to take an eeg with sleep deprivation, to rule out possible epilepsy seizures during my sleep, since there seems to be a family history (both my parents had a brother with epilepsy).

I know i don´t have it, or any symptoms of epilepsy while i´m awake, just those jumps in my sleep.

My question is, is that test the one you take to rule out epilepsy, ore are there any more specialized ones? I´m really new to epilepsy and my doctor isn´t a neurologist, he´s a sleep doctor.

How exactly are the sleep seizures caused by epilepsy? I don´t twitch, they´re not long and my eyes don´t open. They´re just jumps every several seconds.

I´ve lost the appointment for taking that test because it´s with sleep deprivation. I try to stay up all night but cannot make it. I also haven´t given it much importance cause i feel i don´t have epilepsy, but my sleep doctor says the next step with him is to rule out sleep epilepsy.

Should i take the test? Could my jumps be related to epilepsy?

Thanks for any help,

john.

 

[Meetz1064]

Yes, you

should take the test, and YES it could be related to epilepsy.

All four types of my E (epilepsy) are nocturnal, meaning that they happen in my sleep. I have tonic clonic, myoclonic, electrographic and focal in the left frontal lobe.

Frankly, those jumps you talk about sound similar to myoclonics.

So YES, you need to go have that EEG done, sleep-deprived, and preferably one that you can also do while you're sleeping in your own bed....for up to 24 to 48 hours. Between that and an MRI to check for physical abnormalities, you will find out if you have E.

Good luck, and welcome to CWE!

Meetz
:rock:

 

[dfwtexas]

There are a lot of connections with people with sleep apnea and E...I would take the test to be sure. Even though your doc is not neuro, he can elevauate and refer you to neuro if he finds the test shows you are having seizures.

 

[Nakamova]

Hi John --
There are many forms of epilepsy, including ones similar to what you describe. I agree with Meetz that those sound like myoclonic seizures that you are experiencing. EEGs can help identify or confirm certain types of seizures. Even without a positive EEG result, the clinical evidence (i.e. the actual seizures) can be enough to make an initial diagnosis. At some point you might want to get a referral from your sleep doctor for a neurologist who can give you more information about seizures and potential treatment options.

Are you having the jerks every night or just some of the time? Do you know if they are related to certain triggers (like fatigue, or the sleep apnea itself)?

Best,
Nakamova

 

[nibiru2012]

Thanks for answering...

Hi all:

Thanks for answering. Gosh!!!... I´m kind of scared now. Also with lots of questions. I hope you can bear with me...

Yes, i´m having the jerks/jumps every night. I don´t know if they´re related to triggers or not.

I do know i have them when i´m falling asleep, like what all people have. I get those a lot, with imagery in my mind (little dreams or hallucinations) . But i also jump throughout my sleep all night every night.

It could be caused by apnea, sleep deprivation itself, anxiety, etc. I´ve been told all this. The thing is, whaterer´s causing these jumps, they´re keeping me from haveing deep sleep. I feel exhausted every day for years. I´m out of a job and going to a psychiatrist now to cope with this.

I have absolutely no symptoms of epilepsy awake. Because of the hallucinations and immediate rem onset, i´ve also been diagnosed once narcolepsy (multiple sleep latency test). But i don´t have the cataplexy or sleep attacks. Just severe sleep deprivation.

So i guess i´m gonna re schedule that test. But, is it really accurate? What if it tests negative? What would be the next step. What exactly will it find out or show?

Can i drink in order to be able to stay up all night the night before the test? Will this affect the result?

What other tests are there in order rule out sleep epilepsy? Or is it a matter of taking drugs to see if i improve and therefore it´s sleep epilipsy what i have?

Lastly, is there any video on you tube or anywhere that shows something similar to what i have? I´ve seen pleople having seizures during sleep, but they´re long. They´re not just short jumps, like what i have.

One last question. Isn´t one of the symptoms of epilepsy to have more risk for daytime seizuers from sleep deprivation? I don´t have them, but i´m totally epilepsy ignorant...

Thanks, and i´m sorry for such a long message.

John.

 

[Nakamova]

Hi John --

It's possible that your EEG will test negative, although if you actually fall asleep, the doctors will at least see your jerks, even if it doesn't show up on the EEG. In general, EEGs aren't 100% accurate -- there can be both false positives and false negatives. Either way, your sleep doctor and/or neurologist may want try you on a low dose of some medication to help you sleep. If the jerks are "electrical" in origin, an anti-epilepsy drug may do the trick.

Sleep deprivation can be an epilepsy trigger (which is why they have you stay up all night before an EEG), but it's not the only one. There are many different kinds of epilepsy/seizures. Some people may have seizures triggered by fatigue, but others might have seizures triggered by low blood sugar or bright lights, or unknown factors. They might have them during the day. They might have them at night. They might have tonic-clonic seizures, or simple partials. There are some general symptomatic guidelines, but each person fits into them differently (or in some cases, not at all).

 

[nibiru2012]

Nakamoba:

Hi. Thanks for answering.

Isn´t a polisomnography better to rule out sleep epilepsy then? Why hasn´t it shown up in my polisomnographies before?

Yes, my sleep jumps, at least the ones i get when i´m fallin asleep and and the ones i get when i´m having a nightmare and i can´t wake up are electric.

It´s like this electric shock from my brain down to my back. It´s horrible. The ones when i´m asleep i don´t know.

I even have the text describing one of them from when i took a sleep study in the us (the one where they diagnosed me narcolepsy). The sleep doc there was a neurologist. If it´s any use i can write it down here.

Thanks,

john.

 

[nibiru2012]

Nakamoba

Nakamoba (or anyone please):

I forgot to ask...

What medication can they give me to help me sleep in case they find epilepsy? Does it have side effects?

Can epilepsy seizures during sleep cause sleep deprivation?

Can the sleep apnea itself (oxigen deprivation/effort to breath) cause epilepsy seizures during sleep (like a response of the brain to the apnea)? or is it the other way around (epilepsy during sleep causing sleep apnea)?

Thanks,

John.

 

[Rhea]

John,
Hi and kudos for asking questions about this. So many people don't educate themselves and suffer needlessly for it.
I had no idea what was wrong with me for at lest 5 years. My husband said I "twitched" in my sleep. Never made the connection between all my other symptoms and "twitching" Had a sleep study and that was how it was diagnosed as seizures. Go figure- coulda knocked me over with a feather! So, yes, sleep deprivation(or lousy sleep with no rest) can definitely be seizures or caused by seizures. Keep pursuing this line, and find out what is going on. Could be something simple or more involved. Either way- knowledge is power.

 

[Nakamova]

Hi John --

I think it's more often the case that seizures cause apnea, as opposed to the other way around (but your sleep doctor should be able to give you more info about this). When a seizure occurs, the apnea can result when the brain tells the body to stop breathing to protect itself. BTW, "seizures" and "epilepsy seizures" aren't necessarily different diagnoses -- epilepsy is basically a catch-all diagnostic term that means you've had more than one seizure that appears to originate as the result of misfiring neurons.

Either way, seizures and apnea can definitely lead to sleep deprivation, since your sleep is constantly being interrupted. If your doc decides to prescribe an anti-epilepsy drug, there are several different ones. As with all brain meds, they can potentially have side effects, so there's no way to predict for sure how they will affect you. Your doctor should give you a sense of the different options. Has he prescribed other sleeping pills in the past? Have you had any luck with them?

 

[moonchild1970]

I have the nocturnal seizures too and at times have woke up gasping for air. Not sure if that is sleep apnea or not will have to ask my Dr. So yeah I might possibly have it too.

 

[KelVarQ]

Nocturnal Seizures

Hey John, I've had nocturnal seizures for years before I started having break throughs during the day. Yes, I have E and had the RTL almost 5 years ago and started having seizures again only in my sleep. The images you stated I get as well and this when I close my eyes and I'm about to doze off (I'm still awake though). The images let's me know I'm going to seize as soon as I hit deep sleep. I have the jumping too, but this time it's not my whole body but usually just my left arm bangs and then it looks as if I'm strumming a guitar or sometimes I'll rub my hands on my legs as if I'm wiping them off. I'm not aware of this part, but my husband tells me. I actually wake him up because the movement and I usually make noises. SO ABSOLUTELY get the study done and perhaps you may even be having some seizures during the day without even knowing it. Like many have already stated there's quite a few different types and there were many times that I had a seizure during the day without knowing and somebody (mainly my husband) would tell me afterwards since it only lasted for maybe 10 seconds and I didn't go into any convulsions. Prior to me getting E I had no idea about E and assumed E was simply falling to the ground and convulsing (a scary sight) and only until I got E did I realize one doesn't have to fall or go into convulsions to have a seizure. Hopefully all is well with you but it's better to make sure. BE WELL!

 

[moonchild1970]

I've had nocturnal seizures for years before I started having break throughs during the day. Yes, The images you stated I get as well and this when I close my eyes and I'm about to doze off (I'm still awake though). The images let's me know I'm going to seize as soon as I hit deep sleep. I have the jumping too...

OMG! Kelver you said it perfectly. That is exactly the same stuff that happens to me. Scares me so bad!! Good to kow I am not alone or crazy.

Prior to me getting E I had no idea about E and assumed E was simply falling to the ground and convulsing (a scary sight) and only until I got E did I realize one doesn't have to fall or go into convulsions to have a seizure.

And my viewpoint was the exact same too! I thought there was only one kind of seizure. The fall down kind and I also had no idea you passed out during seizures. I was soooo ignorent...lol.

 

[nibiru2012]

Thanks all

Hi:

Thanks to all...

I already called and schedulled my app for this coming monday. Let´s see if i can stay up all night this time. I think i´m gonna ask for help this time. I don´t know, maybe ask a friend over or somethinig.

I´m also more scared now.

It could be just all my psychological issues and anxiety that make me sleep so bad. My not using my cpap/not being able to adjust to it. But why the jumps.

I mean i´ve also been told that depression causes poor sleep and even early rem onset.

I sure got scared reading the posts of the persons that wrote they also have the images, fast dreams and jumps. Alghough it would be nice to finaly find out something...

Thank you all for your support, i guess i´ll let you know about my exam´s result next week if i take it.

John.

 

[Bernard]

Hi John, welcome to the forum. :hello:

... My question is, is that test the one you take to rule out epilepsy, ore are there any more specialized ones?

A sleep deprived EEG can be very useful in confirming/diagnosing epilepsy conditions, but if the test comes back negative (if you don't experience any of the jumps), it cannot rule it out. EEGs can only record what they record. There are many members here with confirmed cases of epilepsy that have had clean EEG sessions.

... I´m really new to epilepsy and my doctor isn´t a neurologist, he´s a sleep doctor.

How exactly are the sleep seizures caused by epilepsy? I don´t twitch, they´re not long and my eyes don´t open. They´re just jumps every several seconds.

There are several types of seizures. What you are describing sounds like myoclonic seizures. You'd be surprised how many people, after formally being diagnosed with epilepsy, discover that they have been experiencing undiagnosed simple partial seizures or absence seizures for years.

Re: link with sleep apnea - see here: http://www.coping-with-epilepsy.com/forums/f23/night-sweats-sleep-apnea-799/#post7084

 

[Nakamova]

Hi John --

Let us know how your exam goes and what they find out. It may feel scary, but knowledge is power. The more you can get a handle on what is going on, the better-equipped you'll be to tackle it. And we're always here to offer our opinions and support.

Best,
Nakamova

 

[nibiru2012]

Hi:

Yes I´ll try harder to take the exam this time. I´m just sooo exhausted all the time...

What calls my attention is, why don´t people here complain about that? I mean, doesn´t epillepsy affect sleep? Why don´t you all complain about it? Or does the drug to treat it make you sleep better? Or is it the CPAP that also helps? Or just epillepsy doesn´t affect everyone´s sleep?

Surprisingly, after reading threads on this forum, it makes sense to me that I might have seizures or jumps, possibly agravated or caused by untreated sleep apnea. I hardly use my CPAP.

Let´s see what the test shows up... Sorry for so much wining and complaining...

Thank you, thank you , thank you!!!

John.

 

[Meetz1064]

Yes, E can

affect sleep, and vice versa........sleep DEFINITELY affects E. It can be a VERY vicious cycle.

I didn't mean to scare you with my first post, I was just simply trying to give you some facts. However, it is true, you may very well be suffering from E and sleep apnea both, and they both may be aggravating each other.

OR, you may be suffering from just E. Whichever it is, you deserve to know the truth, and being scared........well, don't be. I'd be more scared of having cancer, or losing a limb, frankly. But, that's just me.

There ARE meds that can help can control E, especially myoclonic E. And, there are alternative ways to controlling it, also. Diet is one, neurofeedback is another. Be proactive in your health, take a deep breath, do some meditation, listen to some calming CDs, and talk calmly with some friends and family about what's going on. IT WILL BE OK.

Besides. You have us to lean on.

Take care. Feel free to holler if you need anything. I'm a simple private message away.

Meetz
:rock:

 

[nibiru2012]

Thank you and all for your support.

You´re right. There are other more serious, painful diseases, I guess.

I always forget to ask one more thing when I write.

Does anyone wake up at night with fear or panic from the jumps/sizures, and difficulty to go back to sleep? Or do you get them without realizing it?

John.

 

[moonchild1970]

Yes when I had one episode where I saw the bright lights and felt the huge crushing weight on me and I was paralyzed and couldn't breathe, speak or move it terrified me. Saddest thing was I was right next to my sleeping husband (who had no clue)but when I tried to call out to him or reach him but couldn't. He never knew what happened til I told him after.

I sat up the rest of the night with the light on.