I have someone I care of who claims she suffers from seizures, but I've been a CNA for many years. I know what an epileptic seizures looks like in all variety. She's the first person I know that can control when she has a seizure and can make a script last more than one month especially when she's supposed to take two pills a day. I know that she has had legal problems but I hadnt seen her have a seizure in the past until she was arrested. I need help understanding as to what a pseudoseizures is and is it possible for someone to be missed diagnosed with seizures for attention?
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- Thread starter Mande2012
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Hi Mande2012,
Welcome to CWE! Everyone here has been a great help to me and I've had epilepsy for 45 yrs.
A psuedoseizure is known as a fake seizure another words a person is doing it for attention or there's a chance that when the person is having the seizure and the Dr. has done tests on the person it's not showing up on the test.
Years ago when I was a kid my neuro at the time thought I was having psuedoseizures but after a lot of detailed tests they found that the damage was so deep in my brain that not a single test showed any problems. It wasn't until I had brain surgery and my neurosurgeon found damage on the frontal and left temporal lobe that never showed on a single test. The only thing that ever showed was scar tissue on the right temporal lobe. I wish you the best of luck and May God Bless You!
Sue
Welcome to CWE! Everyone here has been a great help to me and I've had epilepsy for 45 yrs.
A psuedoseizure is known as a fake seizure another words a person is doing it for attention or there's a chance that when the person is having the seizure and the Dr. has done tests on the person it's not showing up on the test.
Years ago when I was a kid my neuro at the time thought I was having psuedoseizures but after a lot of detailed tests they found that the damage was so deep in my brain that not a single test showed any problems. It wasn't until I had brain surgery and my neurosurgeon found damage on the frontal and left temporal lobe that never showed on a single test. The only thing that ever showed was scar tissue on the right temporal lobe. I wish you the best of luck and May God Bless You!
Sue
A pseudoseizure can be an intentionally "faked" seizure, but many times the reason for seizures is psychological and the person experiencing the seizure is not intentionally faking. In other words, the seizure(s) is/are the unconcious/unintentional manifestation of severe stress. The seizure feels very real to the person experiencing the seizure.
The term pseudoseizure is also applied to other physical and neurological conditions in which motor manifestations of the disorder appear like a seizure, but are not. A key example is paroxysmal dystonia.
Many people have seizures for which they retain consciousness. These types of seizures are called partial seizures, although myoclonic and tonic seizures also are associated with retained consciousness. Sometimes these types of seizures have warnings, and if so often individuals will attempt to minimize or control the seizure with strategies they have learned (as a simple example, if someone has a partial seizure that affects their right arm and they feel a warning, they may sit on their right hand to avoid obvious movement/stiffening. It doesn't mean the seizure isn't happening; it might just look less obvious to an observer).
As for your patient not taking pills regularly: unfortunately that is common for people with many chronic health conditions that require regular medication to keep the condition under control. When feeling fine, the pills are put aside in hopes they may not be needed anymore, then when symptoms reappear pill consumption resumes.
An epileptologist (a neurologist who specializes in epilepsy) is well-versed in distinguishing between the various seizure types. You may want to encourage the individual to see this type of specialist if he/she has not already done so. Leave the diagnosis in the hands of the experts, and once the diagnosis is made and treatment decided upon, you can then encourage your patient to follow the treatment protocol.
The term pseudoseizure is also applied to other physical and neurological conditions in which motor manifestations of the disorder appear like a seizure, but are not. A key example is paroxysmal dystonia.
Many people have seizures for which they retain consciousness. These types of seizures are called partial seizures, although myoclonic and tonic seizures also are associated with retained consciousness. Sometimes these types of seizures have warnings, and if so often individuals will attempt to minimize or control the seizure with strategies they have learned (as a simple example, if someone has a partial seizure that affects their right arm and they feel a warning, they may sit on their right hand to avoid obvious movement/stiffening. It doesn't mean the seizure isn't happening; it might just look less obvious to an observer).
As for your patient not taking pills regularly: unfortunately that is common for people with many chronic health conditions that require regular medication to keep the condition under control. When feeling fine, the pills are put aside in hopes they may not be needed anymore, then when symptoms reappear pill consumption resumes.
An epileptologist (a neurologist who specializes in epilepsy) is well-versed in distinguishing between the various seizure types. You may want to encourage the individual to see this type of specialist if he/she has not already done so. Leave the diagnosis in the hands of the experts, and once the diagnosis is made and treatment decided upon, you can then encourage your patient to follow the treatment protocol.
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Is the script for anti-seizure meds? If so, taking anti-seizure medicines inconsistently, that can potentially be dangerous. If your friend is taking anti-seizure meds that she doesn't need, that's also problematic. But, as noted above, those are issues best determined by a skilled neurologist. Encourage your friend to see one, especially if her symptoms aren't fully controlled.
Some people can experience both epileptic seizures AND ones that are psychological in origin. And while there are certain physiological responses that are associated with epileptic seizures, they don't occur in every case. The diagnosis isn't always clear-cut. Ideally your friend should check in periodically with her neuro, who can review her symptoms and treatment. If there is a psychological component, a referral to a therapist would be ideal.
"Pseudoseizures" is old terminology for seizures that are non-epileptic in nature - the terminology that is generally used now is "psychogenic non-epileptic seizures." It is considered to be a conversion disorder, in which psychological trauma and distress are manifested in physical symptoms, in this case with seizures.
A person with PNES is NOT faking seizures or having them for attention. They are having very real and very distressing symptoms that are completely outside of their conscious control. It can be very difficult to treat. It is also possible for someone who actually has epilepsy to have psychogenic seizures as well.
Of course it is also possible for a person to simply "fake" a seizure in order to manipulate people or get attention. But that would be a different kind of psychological issue, with a completely different origin than PNES or "pseudoseizures." Do you know what the basis for her epilepsy diagnosis was? Was it based simply on the clinical presentation of seizures, or were EEGs or other diagnostic testing done? Have her seizures been under control with medication in the past, or is she considered to have "intractable" (i.e. drug-resistant) epilepsy? And what makes you conclude that her seizures are under her conscious control?
The lines between these things can overlap quite a bit. Stress can trigger an epileptic seizure - so it can appear that it was consciously controlled when it was simply due to a lowered seizure threshold due to stress (for instance, my daughter had a seizure once the day before her 10th grade finals - while it was likely triggered by stress, she did not "cause" the seizure to get out of finals lol). So it can be hard to distinguish these different issues.
Hope this helps.
A person with PNES is NOT faking seizures or having them for attention. They are having very real and very distressing symptoms that are completely outside of their conscious control. It can be very difficult to treat. It is also possible for someone who actually has epilepsy to have psychogenic seizures as well.
Of course it is also possible for a person to simply "fake" a seizure in order to manipulate people or get attention. But that would be a different kind of psychological issue, with a completely different origin than PNES or "pseudoseizures." Do you know what the basis for her epilepsy diagnosis was? Was it based simply on the clinical presentation of seizures, or were EEGs or other diagnostic testing done? Have her seizures been under control with medication in the past, or is she considered to have "intractable" (i.e. drug-resistant) epilepsy? And what makes you conclude that her seizures are under her conscious control?
The lines between these things can overlap quite a bit. Stress can trigger an epileptic seizure - so it can appear that it was consciously controlled when it was simply due to a lowered seizure threshold due to stress (for instance, my daughter had a seizure once the day before her 10th grade finals - while it was likely triggered by stress, she did not "cause" the seizure to get out of finals lol). So it can be hard to distinguish these different issues.
Hope this helps.
She's seen several neurologist all of them have released her from their care or refused to take her on as a client. She's also had several severe tests to diagnose her so please help me decide if I need to remain as her caretaker or would anyone believe that she would be capable of being home alone with her children. Right now as it sits her family won't help her and I only get one day to myself.
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Mande --
It sounds like you're in a tight spot -- wanting to help your friend, but uncomfortable with the circumstances and worried about enabling what may be her manipulative behavior. There's no way for us to make the decision for you, but from what you describe it sounds like you want to move on. Are there any social service agencies that could help?
It sounds like you're in a tight spot -- wanting to help your friend, but uncomfortable with the circumstances and worried about enabling what may be her manipulative behavior. There's no way for us to make the decision for you, but from what you describe it sounds like you want to move on. Are there any social service agencies that could help?
No because she doesn't have an assigned neurologist or SSI or SSD. where we live they do not help people unless the government assigns someone to you. I also believe that her family should be willing to help if they believe that there is something wrong with her especially since she has children.
She's not worried about whether or not she's taking meds as prescribed. Her last episode was in November. I keep expecting another episode soon, but it hasn't happened yet. The last episode was brought on by someone telling her they were going to help their sister find a cat.
Hi Mande,
Is there any way she can see a neuropsychiatrist? These Drs. can do tests and find out what's going on with her both in the neurology end of it as well as the psychiatric part.
Over the yrs. while I've worded in Special Education I've had students that had E. that had to go into a mental institution do to the way the epilepsy effect them. I wish you
and your friend only the best and May God Bless the both of You!
Sue
Is there any way she can see a neuropsychiatrist? These Drs. can do tests and find out what's going on with her both in the neurology end of it as well as the psychiatric part.
Over the yrs. while I've worded in Special Education I've had students that had E. that had to go into a mental institution do to the way the epilepsy effect them. I wish you
and your friend only the best and May God Bless the both of You!
Sue
I can't figure out how to quote 2 different posts LOL - but I'll answer both of them.
1) Yes, eye twitches can be a sign of seizures for some people. There are many different types of seizures, and eye twitches can be a symptom. They can can also be due to other things such as tics.
2) Valium is a very common "rescue" medication for epilepsy. Other rescue medications are ativan and midazolam. It is not generally used on a daily basis to prevent seizures, but will be used on an as-needed basis to interrupt lengthy or clustering seizures, or possibly for occasional use if someone feels a seizure coming on. But it will almost certainly be an "adjunct" or rescue medication, and not the primary anti-epileptic drug that would be prescribed.
1) Yes, eye twitches can be a sign of seizures for some people. There are many different types of seizures, and eye twitches can be a symptom. They can can also be due to other things such as tics.
2) Valium is a very common "rescue" medication for epilepsy. Other rescue medications are ativan and midazolam. It is not generally used on a daily basis to prevent seizures, but will be used on an as-needed basis to interrupt lengthy or clustering seizures, or possibly for occasional use if someone feels a seizure coming on. But it will almost certainly be an "adjunct" or rescue medication, and not the primary anti-epileptic drug that would be prescribed.
