Ect

[steve1958]

I have seen this mentioned in a few posts across the Forum
So thought it appropriate to add a post about it.

Electro Convulsive Therapy.
Many years ago Psychiatric Hospitals were full of long stay patients with either Schizophrenia or Epilepsy.
Sadly if we had been born 100 years earlier we would be one of them, living our life in an institution, locked away from society.

Then one day a ‘Clever Dr’ realised that the schizophrenics didn’t have Epilepsy!
This was to be the cause of many thousands of Schizophrenics being given Brain operations to turn them into Epileptics, or to be Given ECT to make them have fits, in the hope that this would cure their Schizophrenia. onder:

Back then ECT was given without anaesthetic, and the poor patient was tied down to a bench, and still alert whilst the electrodes were placed on their head.
Not nice at all.

The outcome.
Yes, you guessed it. We ended up with Schizophrenics that now suffered epileptic fits.
A total failure, or worse.

I work as a staff nurse in a Psychiatric Hospital in the UK.
I am very aware that this would have been my home if I had been born 100 years ago.

The medication to control Fits did not exist then, and looking through the photos in the Hospital Library the Staff didn’t appear so caring either. They were more like Prison Officers.

Men and Women were kept on separate wards. You didn’t have any personal possessions. All dignity was stripped away. It was a very scary life.

Then as new medications were ‘Invented’, it was tested on these people.
Some died through over medication. Some died through fitting.

Thanks to these poor soules we are able to live lives of normality.
Ok taking a handfull of meds a day maynot feel normal, but things could be a lot worse.

ECT is not used very often nowadays.
Definatelly not to treat Epilepsy.
It has been found to be of benefit to some depressed people.
The treatment is done under anesthetic so the patient is unaware of the events.
The law has changed in the UK so that Drs can no longer give it without the patients consent, unless they can prove the patient's life is at risk without it.
So some severely depressed people that arent responding to medication are still given it (but not many thankfully).

Fotunately I do not have to work within the ECT department.
My Boss realises it would be very insensitive to ask me to go there as I am Epileptic. Its not nice watching someone be forced to have a fit.

 

[Nakamova]

Thanks Steve. There's a lot of good info to be found here:
http://www.nmha.org/go/information/get-info/treatment/electroconvulsive-therapy-ect

 

[Cint]

I have just one question Steve and that is, why do you folks in Europe call seizures, "fits"?
It makes me think of someone throwing "fit", or a temper tantrum. I hate that word when speaking of seizures!

 

[steve1958]

I have just one question Steve and that is, why do you folks in Europe call seizures, "fits"?
It makes me think of someone throwing "fit", or a temper tantrum. I hate that word when speaking of seizures!

Seizures = fits
Bathrooms = Toilets
Gas = Petrol

The english language is slightly different here as the above examples show.

The good thing is we still understand each other

 

[Fedup]

steve1958

There is a bit of info there. The one thing though the medical treatment in Ireland only changes after England does and usually a few years at that. Believe it or not E.C.T. was still used up to the 70s even though it was supposed to be stopped. Nearly ended up in one with being given E.C.T. I was lucky. There are a few who were not so lucky, if I am not mistaken there are two members here who were not that lucky when it came to E.C.T.

 

[Chelsea]

I actually had ECT in April 2010 for depression. Ironically, it is not contraindicated in people with epilepsy. It was horrifying.

The anesthesiologist didn't administer the propofol (anesthetic; 'milk of amnesia') before dosing the paralyzing agent (succinylcholine), I could feel myself suffocating. I thought I was going to die. I was cold, alone, and dying in the OR. I begged God for one more chance at life. I was going through ECT and the experience only to realize that I hadn't lived yet at 26.

I felt them lift my hand, and it flopped down on the table (because I was paralyzed including my heart and lungs). They said, "We're ready..." I was still semi-conscious.

I remember waking up, and I didn't even know my name. I had no idea what I was doing in the psych ward. I had 1 treatment every Mon/Wed/Fri for three weeks. It was pure hell.

It did change my life, and the only positive was that I learned that I'll never have a seizure forced on me externally EVER again.

 

[Fedup]

Chelsea

I am sorry to hear you had your share of it. At 26 you have a lot to learn young woman and I hope you enjoy it all. Best of luck.

 

[steve1958]

That’s really horrible Chelsea.
I hope you never have to suffer anything like that again.

Sadly low moods do happen to people with Epilepsy.
and because of the medication we are already taking it can cause the Drs a few problems in prescribing treatment.
We are all very different individuals, so what works for one will not necessarily work for another.

It seems the treatment for Depression is Medication.
However I sometimes think that this is not the best option, especially if there is a cause for the depression (Bereavement, Loss of job, other life changes).

The medication cant change a persons life events.
It doesn’t really cheer them up either from what I have seen.
It just makes them 'Not care' about their low mood.

Interestingly enough, some of the medications prescribed for treating Epilepsy have also been found to have 'stabilising' qualities that are beneficial in treating depression, and have inherited the title of 'Mood stabilisers'.

For myself I found I had to work things out in my own mind.
After a month of crying and feeling lost and alone, I began to realise that life is good.
I can remember going for a walk in the rain.
(Its good walking in the rain because no one notices your tears),
Whilst walking I suddenly realised that I had a life.
I had many blessings that others could only dream of.
A family, a job, food in my fridge, a home, good physical health, and a freedom that many do not have.
I realised that my Heavenly Father had blessed me, but I had failed to see the blessings. I still felt low in my mood, but from that day onwards things started changing.
I continue to give thanks for what I have been blessed with.
I even give thanks for the side effects my medication gives me, as they are a little reminder that without my tablets I would be dead or worse.

 

[CathyAnn31]

Very interesting thread. Thanks to everyone that's contributed.

 

[Chelsea]

Chelsea

I am sorry to hear you had your share of it. At 26 you have a lot to learn young woman and I hope you enjoy it all. Best of luck.

Thanks. I am fedup with the psychiatric establishment, and the majority of the neurological field as well. There are so many unknowns. Psychiatry hasn't established evidence-based testing for some of the 'disorders' that exist in the Manual--there is only statistical evidence. There are no blood or brain blood samples that can be taken for serotonin levels, say, that would be testable. You know? There are SO many things humans don't know about brain workings.

I saw a shooting star this morning! It traveled right through Orion. --Sorry, a little off topic.

 

[Chelsea]

That’s really horrible Chelsea.
I hope you never have to suffer anything like that again.

Sadly low moods do happen to people with Epilepsy.
and because of the medication we are already taking it can cause the Drs a few problems in prescribing treatment.
We are all very different individuals, so what works for one will not necessarily work for another.

It seems the treatment for Depression is Medication.
However I sometimes think that this is not the best option, especially if there is a cause for the depression (Bereavement, Loss of job, other life changes).

The medication cant change a persons life events.
It doesn’t really cheer them up either from what I have seen.
It just makes them 'Not care' about their low mood.

Interestingly enough, some of the medications prescribed for treating Epilepsy have also been found to have 'stabilising' qualities that are beneficial in treating depression, and have inherited the title of 'Mood stabilisers'.

For myself I found I had to work things out in my own mind.
After a month of crying and feeling lost and alone, I began to realise that life is good.
I can remember going for a walk in the rain.
(Its good walking in the rain because no one notices your tears),
Whilst walking I suddenly realised that I had a life.
I had many blessings that others could only dream of.
A family, a job, food in my fridge, a home, good physical health, and a freedom that many do not have.
I realised that my Heavenly Father had blessed me, but I had failed to see the blessings. I still felt low in my mood, but from that day onwards things started changing.
I continue to give thanks for what I have been blessed with.
I even give thanks for the side effects my medication gives me, as they are a little reminder that without my tablets I would be dead or worse.

Hi, Steve. I also work in conjunction with the medicine. With a therapist's help, I am facing the reality of E/recent diagnosis. Like you, I also use spiritual tools that help me meditate on positive facts of life. I am going to the library today, where I look up yoga, relaxation techniques, and tools to deal with anxiety/depression that are natural/don't involve medicine/herbals.

Thanks for your help. The people on CWE are sensitive to the concerns of others, and helpful--it's good that we all can laugh at each other most times. Just like in Psalms, there is a variety of emotion on the Forum. Each individual brings his or her uniqueness to it. It makes the experience special for me!

 

[Cint]

Thanks. I am fedup with the psychiatric establishment, and the majority of the neurological field as well. There are so many unknowns. Psychiatry hasn't established evidence-based testing for some of the 'disorders' that exist in the Manual--there is only statistical evidence. There are no blood or brain blood samples that can be taken for serotonin levels, say, that would be testable. You know? There are SO many things humans don't know about brain workings.

I saw a shooting star this morning! It traveled right through Orion. --Sorry, a little off topic.

Chelsea,

I'm sorry to hear of your experience with ECT. That should not have happened in today's society if seeing an experienced neuropsychiatrist. I've suffered for years with deep depression, the dr. even went as far as saying I was bipolar. And I was seeing a well known neuropsychiatrist, specializing in the things epilepsy/seizures do to the brain. He did once insinuate that perhaps if I did have a seizure, I would feel better, but never did ECT. At the time we couldn't find any meds to alleviate the the depression/suicidal thoughts. And I had all the reason to be HAPPY. After all, I was married to a successful pilot, had two children, lived in a beautiful home, so why in the world was I SO depressed? Even my husband at the time couldn't figure out why. He obviously thought $$ brings health and happiness. But it was the workings and the neurotransmitters in the brain that folks don't understand that can make or BREAK people. And that is what nearly killed me, along with a few seizures. So my advice to anyone out there with epilepsy who is struggling with anxiety, depression, suicidal thoughts, seek out a NEUROPSYCHIATRIST, not just a psychiatrist. They don't know their butt from their heads when it comes to something as complex as this.

Check this out:
http://www.pni.org/neuropsychiatry/seizures/

 

[jackier]

ECT is performed quite frequently here in America. My last job was as a Customer Service Rep for a Mental Health insurance co. We got calls from hospitals who wanted to authorize that procedure about once a month. Also, about three years ago, my brother was severely depressed and he had ECT several times. It didn't work for him in the long run. Chelsea, I'm sorry you went through that. It does seem like in today's age that something else would take it's place-something less invasive.

"Electroconvulsive therapy (ECT) is practiced widely in the United States and the rest of the world [1]. It is used mainly to treat severe depression, but is also indicated for patients with other conditions, including bipolar disorder, schizophrenia, schizoaffective disorder, delirium, and neuroleptic malignant syndrome."
http://www.uptodate.com/contents/technique-for-performing-electroconvulsive-therapy-ect-in-adults

 

[Chelsea]

ECT is performed quite frequently here in America. My last job was as a Customer Service Rep for a Mental Health insurance co. We got calls from hospitals who wanted to authorize that procedure about once a month. Also, about three years ago, my brother was severely depressed and he had ECT several times. It didn't work for him in the long run. Chelsea, I'm sorry you went through that. It does seem like in today's age that something else would take it's place-something less invasive.

"Electroconvulsive therapy (ECT) is practiced widely in the United States and the rest of the world [1]. It is used mainly to treat severe depression, but is also indicated for patients with other conditions, including bipolar disorder, schizophrenia, schizoaffective disorder, delirium, and neuroleptic malignant syndrome."
http://www.uptodate.com/contents/technique-for-performing-electroconvulsive-therapy-ect-in-adults

I'm sorry to hear that your brother went through ECT, too. It didn't help me in the long-run either. I was back on the same medications in 6 months.

 

[steve1958]

It appears quite common that after someone does have a course of ECT and their mood does lift, they are then put on 'Mood stabilising' medication in the hope that it will help prevent them becoming depressed again

Interestingly enough many of these 'Mood stabilisers' were first created to treat Epilepsy.

 

[Chelsea]

Hey, Steve, it seems like a paradox. When I have a seizure, I feel severely depressed for 2-3 days, and low-mood subsides. It's like the air clearing of a light fog. How is your mood afterwards? I can also be so irritable that I am volatile to be around.onder:

 

[steve1958]

My family inform me that I get very irritable before a fit, though I deny this of course

After a fit - low, and very tired.
I guess knowing that you have had a fit is enough to depress you,
and the physical energy involved is certainly enough to knock you of your feet for a while.

I guess also following a fit I end up hiding from the world because I dont want anyone to see the damage.
So stuck in doors for a week or so can be depressing.

But then my brain starts doing the thinking thing again and I feel good.

One thing that doesnt help is when people around me that have no idea what its like start telling me they feel for me, and asking what happened.
I know they are only trying to be kind, but I just want to tell them to leave me alone. So a bit grumpy I guess.

So somewhere like this site where people do know what its like, and are able to show genuine feelings is a great blessing.