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Zoe
:Sarah,
It looks like we're on the same soap box regarding nutrition. One concern you've likely heard, what about vitamin B 12? I have found a few references to how it might be obtained from plants and am gathering more data on this.
--------------
Yesterday 10:45 AM - permalinkZoe
Here is more information on soy and glutamate we can all discuss. Below is a link to an interview with Dr. Russell Blaylock, who has written a lot about exctiotoxins and the nervous system.
The article raises some questions in my mind, so don't buy everything in it hook, line, and sinker. Blaylock clearly states that the excitotoxin in soy is MSG. What's not clear is whether all soyfoods contain MSG, in any form. The form of glutamate that is naturally found in food is not processed in the same way as that which is added to food in the form of MSG.
The conspiracy theories surrounding this issue are making it difficult to get a clear picture on the safety, on non safety, of soy and soy foods. I wrote to a scientist who studied soy and is an expert on the subject. It may be a while before getting a response but the subject is worth our attention.
http://www.naturalnews.com/z020550.html
--------------------
LivingFruity
I read the book Excitotoxins: The Taste That Kills by Blaylock about the time Elijah had his seizures in 2007. This was an eye opener for me. Later I found and printed this article from Dr. Blaylock online: http://www.rense.com/politics6/excito.htm. I keep it in a folder here with highlighted areas for reference in case extended family question why I'm doing what I am.
I've not been too worried about B-12. I've done a lot of research and find that B-12 is actually made in our bodies from special enzymes found in various plants. Other ways of getting B-12 is through eating meat of an animal (who made B-12 from plants they ate) or through taking vitamins. Those people who are usually deficient, aren't deficient because it isn't in their diets, they're deficient because their bodies are not assimilating (absorbing and using) the B-12. The majority of B-12 deficiencies reported are among meat eaters. It doesn't really matter what you eat, it matters that your body is healthy enough to function properly, make the B-12, and then absorb it. Here's an article by Dr Vetrano on B-12: http://www.roylretreat.com/articles/b12.html
--------------------
Zoe
Here is more information on soy and glutamate we can all discuss. Below is a link to an interview with Dr. Russell Blaylock, who has written a lot about exctiotoxins and the nervous system.
The article raises some questions in my mind, so don't buy everything in it hook, line, and sinker. Blaylock clearly states that the excitotoxin in soy is MSG. What's not clear is whether all soyfoods contain MSG, in any form. The form of glutamate that is naturally found in food is not processed in the same way as that which is added to food in the form of MSG.
The conspiracy theories surrounding this issue are making it difficult to get a clear picture on the safety, or non safety, of soy and soy foods. I wrote to a scientist who studied soy and is an expert on the subject. It may be a while before getting a response but the subject is worth our attention.
My understanding thus far is that the glutamate naturally found in food converts to glutamine and glutamic acid in the process of digestion. The glutamic acid that forms during digestion is not stored in the body.
The glutamate acid that is in food is called bound (connected to other amino acids in a molecule). When it is broken down during digestion it is affected by other amino acids and is not normally toxic. When glutamate is separated to form MSG, it is free. It is looking like the free form MSG is what is toxic to the nervous system. Many, if not most, soy foods have MSG added when they are produced. Not all soy foods have added MSG, in obvious or hidden forms.
Very clearly, from my searching, a lot of the anti-soy information is misleading and distorts some of the research studies's results. The misinformation is equally obvious in some of the pro-soy information. We need to consider information from all points of view to get more clarity on this subject. Keep in mind it is the free glutamate that appears to be an excitotoxin, not the bound glutamate that occurs naturally in many foods.
This quote is from an article by James South. Again, note that it is the additive form of glutamate that is excitotoxic-and is very common.
"Yet another issue that makes the blood-brain barrier defense of MSG/aspartame irrelevant is brain glucose transport. Glucose is the primary fuel the brain uses to generate its ATP energy. Continual adequate brain ATP levels are needed, as noted earlier, to prevent glutamate/aspartate from shifting from neurotranmitters to excitotoxins. Creasey and Malawista found that feeding high doses of glucose to mice could decrease the amount of glutamate entering the brain by 35%, with even higher glutamate doses leading to a 64% reduction in brain glucose content (21). Since the brain is unable to store glucose, this glutamate effect alone could be a major basis for promoting excitotoxicity.
MSG/aspartame defenders also like to point out that glutamate and aspartate are natural constituents of food protein, which is generally considered safe, so why the concern over MSG/aspartame (2)? Yet there is a key difference between food-derived glutamate/aspartate and MSG/aspartame. Food glutamate/aspartate comes in the form of proteins, which contain 20 other amino acids, and take time to digest, slowing the release of protein bound glutamate/aspartate like a "timed-release capsule." This in turn moderates the rise in blood levels of glutamate/aspartate. Also, when glutamate and aspartate are received by the liver (first stop after intestinal absorption) along with 20 other aminos, they are used to make various proteins. This also moderates the rise in blood glutamate/aspartate levels. Yet when the single [free] amino MSG is rapidly absorbed (especially in solution - e.g. soups, sauces and gravies), not requiring digestion, human and animal experiments show rapid rises in glutamate, 5 to 20 times normal blood levels (2). Aspartame is a dipeptide - a union of 2 aminos- and there exist special di-and tripeptide intestinal absorption pathways that allow rapid and efficient absorption (21). The dipeptides are then separated into free aminos, and as with free MSG there will be a rapid rise in blood aspartate. Thus the characteristics of food-bound glutamate/aspartate and MSG/aspartame are completely different. The phenomenon of excitotoxicity can occur even if you never use MSG/aspartame, since neurons can produce their own glutamate/aspartate.
Nonetheless, given the danger of even slight rises in synaptic glutamate/aspartate levels, prudence dictates that dietary MSG/aspartame be avoided whenever possible, especially if you fall into the category of those with weakened blood-brain barrier previously mentioned - diabetes, stroke victims, Alzheimer’s patients, etc. And once you begin reading food labels, watching out not only for MSG/aspartame, but also for "hydrolysed vegetable protein," "natural flavor," "spice," "caseinate digest," "yeast extract," etc., you will be amazed at how common MSG and aspartame are in the modern food supply." Link to full article:
http://www.smart-drugs.com/ias-excitotoxins.htm
Keep in mind that folks who make their living promoting or producing "natural "foods are out to make a profit just as much as any of the larger corporations. Just because a food is labeled "natural" doesn't mean it is free of MSG or other ingredients one may need to avoid.
ILink to interview with Blaylock:
http://www.naturalnews.com/020550.html
------------------
Zoe
Sarah,
The post you read was truncated when my phone cut off. I deleted it and posted the full version.
I was very impressed with "Excitotoxins" when I read it I am concerned that some of the glutamate information is not presented clearly or fairly.
I'm checking out what you posted about B-12. I'm very interested because my grandmother had pernicious anemia, an inherited inability to absorb B-12 and I've had some problems regarding B-12 too.
------------------
Zoe
Sarah,
I'm reading the ROYL link. Are you and your family on a raw food diet? If so, for how long? One of my neighbors was on it this summer.
-----------------
LivingFruity
Zoe, I started eating a high-raw (75% raw) diet in May of 2007. The benefits I felt were amazing. In January of 2008 I went 100% raw and never looked back. My family (husband and children) eat a high-raw vegan diet. Most of their fruits and veggies are eaten fresh and uncooked. I'll still prepare fresh steamed veggies or roasted potatoes for them on occasion. I also make some homemade veggie dips and salad dressings for the children that aren't raw. They will also eat roasted nuts as well as raw nuts. I don't do soy products at all. When we first eliminated meat and dairy, we relied a lot on soy milk, tofu, and other soy products. I stopped using soy because I don't believe that it's nutritionally necessary in our diet and it's highly processed. Soy is a controversial subject in a lot of studies.
--------------
:Sarah,
It looks like we're on the same soap box regarding nutrition. One concern you've likely heard, what about vitamin B 12? I have found a few references to how it might be obtained from plants and am gathering more data on this.
--------------
Yesterday 10:45 AM - permalinkZoe
Here is more information on soy and glutamate we can all discuss. Below is a link to an interview with Dr. Russell Blaylock, who has written a lot about exctiotoxins and the nervous system.
The article raises some questions in my mind, so don't buy everything in it hook, line, and sinker. Blaylock clearly states that the excitotoxin in soy is MSG. What's not clear is whether all soyfoods contain MSG, in any form. The form of glutamate that is naturally found in food is not processed in the same way as that which is added to food in the form of MSG.
The conspiracy theories surrounding this issue are making it difficult to get a clear picture on the safety, on non safety, of soy and soy foods. I wrote to a scientist who studied soy and is an expert on the subject. It may be a while before getting a response but the subject is worth our attention.
http://www.naturalnews.com/z020550.html
--------------------
LivingFruity
I read the book Excitotoxins: The Taste That Kills by Blaylock about the time Elijah had his seizures in 2007. This was an eye opener for me. Later I found and printed this article from Dr. Blaylock online: http://www.rense.com/politics6/excito.htm. I keep it in a folder here with highlighted areas for reference in case extended family question why I'm doing what I am.
I've not been too worried about B-12. I've done a lot of research and find that B-12 is actually made in our bodies from special enzymes found in various plants. Other ways of getting B-12 is through eating meat of an animal (who made B-12 from plants they ate) or through taking vitamins. Those people who are usually deficient, aren't deficient because it isn't in their diets, they're deficient because their bodies are not assimilating (absorbing and using) the B-12. The majority of B-12 deficiencies reported are among meat eaters. It doesn't really matter what you eat, it matters that your body is healthy enough to function properly, make the B-12, and then absorb it. Here's an article by Dr Vetrano on B-12: http://www.roylretreat.com/articles/b12.html
--------------------
Zoe
Here is more information on soy and glutamate we can all discuss. Below is a link to an interview with Dr. Russell Blaylock, who has written a lot about exctiotoxins and the nervous system.
The article raises some questions in my mind, so don't buy everything in it hook, line, and sinker. Blaylock clearly states that the excitotoxin in soy is MSG. What's not clear is whether all soyfoods contain MSG, in any form. The form of glutamate that is naturally found in food is not processed in the same way as that which is added to food in the form of MSG.
The conspiracy theories surrounding this issue are making it difficult to get a clear picture on the safety, or non safety, of soy and soy foods. I wrote to a scientist who studied soy and is an expert on the subject. It may be a while before getting a response but the subject is worth our attention.
My understanding thus far is that the glutamate naturally found in food converts to glutamine and glutamic acid in the process of digestion. The glutamic acid that forms during digestion is not stored in the body.
The glutamate acid that is in food is called bound (connected to other amino acids in a molecule). When it is broken down during digestion it is affected by other amino acids and is not normally toxic. When glutamate is separated to form MSG, it is free. It is looking like the free form MSG is what is toxic to the nervous system. Many, if not most, soy foods have MSG added when they are produced. Not all soy foods have added MSG, in obvious or hidden forms.
Very clearly, from my searching, a lot of the anti-soy information is misleading and distorts some of the research studies's results. The misinformation is equally obvious in some of the pro-soy information. We need to consider information from all points of view to get more clarity on this subject. Keep in mind it is the free glutamate that appears to be an excitotoxin, not the bound glutamate that occurs naturally in many foods.
This quote is from an article by James South. Again, note that it is the additive form of glutamate that is excitotoxic-and is very common.
"Yet another issue that makes the blood-brain barrier defense of MSG/aspartame irrelevant is brain glucose transport. Glucose is the primary fuel the brain uses to generate its ATP energy. Continual adequate brain ATP levels are needed, as noted earlier, to prevent glutamate/aspartate from shifting from neurotranmitters to excitotoxins. Creasey and Malawista found that feeding high doses of glucose to mice could decrease the amount of glutamate entering the brain by 35%, with even higher glutamate doses leading to a 64% reduction in brain glucose content (21). Since the brain is unable to store glucose, this glutamate effect alone could be a major basis for promoting excitotoxicity.
MSG/aspartame defenders also like to point out that glutamate and aspartate are natural constituents of food protein, which is generally considered safe, so why the concern over MSG/aspartame (2)? Yet there is a key difference between food-derived glutamate/aspartate and MSG/aspartame. Food glutamate/aspartate comes in the form of proteins, which contain 20 other amino acids, and take time to digest, slowing the release of protein bound glutamate/aspartate like a "timed-release capsule." This in turn moderates the rise in blood levels of glutamate/aspartate. Also, when glutamate and aspartate are received by the liver (first stop after intestinal absorption) along with 20 other aminos, they are used to make various proteins. This also moderates the rise in blood glutamate/aspartate levels. Yet when the single [free] amino MSG is rapidly absorbed (especially in solution - e.g. soups, sauces and gravies), not requiring digestion, human and animal experiments show rapid rises in glutamate, 5 to 20 times normal blood levels (2). Aspartame is a dipeptide - a union of 2 aminos- and there exist special di-and tripeptide intestinal absorption pathways that allow rapid and efficient absorption (21). The dipeptides are then separated into free aminos, and as with free MSG there will be a rapid rise in blood aspartate. Thus the characteristics of food-bound glutamate/aspartate and MSG/aspartame are completely different. The phenomenon of excitotoxicity can occur even if you never use MSG/aspartame, since neurons can produce their own glutamate/aspartate.
Nonetheless, given the danger of even slight rises in synaptic glutamate/aspartate levels, prudence dictates that dietary MSG/aspartame be avoided whenever possible, especially if you fall into the category of those with weakened blood-brain barrier previously mentioned - diabetes, stroke victims, Alzheimer’s patients, etc. And once you begin reading food labels, watching out not only for MSG/aspartame, but also for "hydrolysed vegetable protein," "natural flavor," "spice," "caseinate digest," "yeast extract," etc., you will be amazed at how common MSG and aspartame are in the modern food supply." Link to full article:
http://www.smart-drugs.com/ias-excitotoxins.htm
Keep in mind that folks who make their living promoting or producing "natural "foods are out to make a profit just as much as any of the larger corporations. Just because a food is labeled "natural" doesn't mean it is free of MSG or other ingredients one may need to avoid.
ILink to interview with Blaylock:
http://www.naturalnews.com/020550.html
------------------
Zoe
Sarah,
The post you read was truncated when my phone cut off. I deleted it and posted the full version.
I was very impressed with "Excitotoxins" when I read it I am concerned that some of the glutamate information is not presented clearly or fairly.
I'm checking out what you posted about B-12. I'm very interested because my grandmother had pernicious anemia, an inherited inability to absorb B-12 and I've had some problems regarding B-12 too.
------------------
Zoe
Sarah,
I'm reading the ROYL link. Are you and your family on a raw food diet? If so, for how long? One of my neighbors was on it this summer.
-----------------
LivingFruity
Zoe, I started eating a high-raw (75% raw) diet in May of 2007. The benefits I felt were amazing. In January of 2008 I went 100% raw and never looked back. My family (husband and children) eat a high-raw vegan diet. Most of their fruits and veggies are eaten fresh and uncooked. I'll still prepare fresh steamed veggies or roasted potatoes for them on occasion. I also make some homemade veggie dips and salad dressings for the children that aren't raw. They will also eat roasted nuts as well as raw nuts. I don't do soy products at all. When we first eliminated meat and dairy, we relied a lot on soy milk, tofu, and other soy products. I stopped using soy because I don't believe that it's nutritionally necessary in our diet and it's highly processed. Soy is a controversial subject in a lot of studies.
--------------