The Science of Seizures

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MichaelJO7

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As some of you know, I am very interested in the science of seizures on an atomic, molecular, and anatomical level. I hope others will find this at least somewhat interesting.

After watching a Spider Man movie, I thought it would be interesting to understand how electric eels are able to generate electric discharges. There our some parallels as to how our own bodies work. For example, our stress response, or fight or flight response, changes the electrical nature of our bodies, and subsequently can trigger seizures.

The eels are able to control their discharges with their brains. Their ability to control their discharges suggests that neurofeedback can help those of us who have E. It would be interesting to see exactly how much electricity our brains generate simply by thinking, or how much our abdominal organs generate to facilitate digestion, or as we respond to stress as well. The following was taken from Wikipedia. (Certain catfish can also generate small electrical discharges).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page

The electric eel has three pairs of abdominal organs that produce electricity: the main organ, the Hunter's organ, and the Sach's organ. These organs make up four-fifths of its body, and are what gives the electric eel the ability to generate two types of electric organ discharges: low voltage and high voltage. These organs are made of electrocytes, lined up so a current of ions can flow through them and stacked so each one adds to a potential difference. When the eel locates its prey, the brain sends a signal through the nervous system to the electrocytes. This opens the ion channels, allowing sodium to flow through, reversing the polarity momentarily. By causing a sudden difference in electric potential, it generates an electric current in a manner similar to a battery, in which stacked plates each produce an electric potential difference. In the electric eel, some 5,000 to 6,000 stacked electroplaques are capable of producing a shock at up to 600 volts and 1 ampere of current (600 watts) for a duration of two milliseconds. It would be extremely unlikely for such a shock to be deadly for an adult human, due to the very short duration of the discharge. Still, this level of current could in theory cause electrocution in humans, depending on the path the current takes through the human body, and the duration of current flow.[citation needed] Heart fibrillation (reversible via a heart defibrillator) can be triggered by electric currents of 700 mA for more than 30 ms.[citation needed]

The Sach's organ is associated with electrolocation.[4] Inside the organ are many muscle-like cells, called electrocytes. Each cell can only produce 0.15 V, though the organ can transmit a signal of nearly 10 V overall in amplitude at around 25 Hz in frequency. These signals are emitted by the main organ; the Hunter's organ can emit signals at rates of several hundred Hertz.[4]
The electric eel is unique among the Gymnotiformes in having large electric organs capable of producing potentially lethal discharges that allow them to stun prey.[5] Larger voltages have been reported, but the typical output is sufficient to stun or deter virtually any animal. Juveniles produce smaller voltages (about 100 V). They are capable of varying the intensity of the electric discharge, using lower discharges for hunting and higher intensities for stunning prey, or defending themselves. When agitated, they are capable of producing these intermittent electric shocks over a period of at least an hour without tiring.

The electric eel also possesses high frequency-sensitive tuberous receptors, which are distributed in patches over its body. This feature is apparently useful for hunting other Gymnotiformes.[4]

Electric eels have been used as a model in the study of bioelectrogenesis.[6] The species is of some interest to researchers, who make use of its acetylcholinesterase and adenosine triphosphate.
 
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The eels are able to control their discharges with their brains. Their ability to control their discharges suggests that neurofeedback can help those of us who have E. It would be interesting to see exactly how much electricity our brains generate simply by thinking,
This is indeed interesting. I wonder though, if in the eels' case it is more of an instinctive reaction and not what we would consider a "thought".

I plan to start neurofeedback soon. Waiting on stoopid Kaiser HMO to get me a neurologist appointment first. Takes forever.
 
When I was a teenager, I would catch catfish in the lake. How come I didn't get a shock when I reeled them in?

I am serious. I am interested in science.
 
You can see the "stingers" near the end of the upper jaw on the catfish. I caught plenty of catfish when I was a kid. They stay alive in the fridge for extended perioed of times in the fridge, without water. I was taught to avoid the stingers, so I always grabbed the fish elsewhere when taking them off of the hook. I have since elected to not eat any fish without scales, or bottomdwellers, for that matter.
 
Thank you Michael. I didn't know that. Thank you for letting me know.

I don't like catfish either. I gave them to friends who ate them.
 
I like your thinking Michael. What is Epilepsy, "a neurological disorder marked by sudden recurrent episodes of sensory disturbance, loss of consciousness, or convulsions, associated with abnormal electrical activity in the brain."

How about put a ground strap on the brain and be able to ground yourself every time an abnormal electrical activity occurs. If they can charge a phone without having to connect it to any power source, just by having it a few inches away from the phone, then surely there is a way to be able to control the electronics in ones head. Maybe through some magnetic strip or something. Where is Nikola Tesla when we need him the most. :)

:piano: :pop:
 
WATCH IT, Zolt, you are getting might close to going backward to when them neurologists drilled holes in the heads of epileptics!
 
How about put a ground strap on the brain and be able to ground yourself every time an abnormal electrical activity occurs.QUOTE]

That is exactly what I do when I drive, and I do not have seizures when I drive. I have one end of a jumper cable connected to the seat frame (which is connected to the body frame of my truck), which is connected to a copper wiring "bracelet" touching my skin on my left hand, which holds my steering wheel. The other hand is connected to the chassis, via the shifting rod (manual transmission) which is metallic. The wiring is heavy gauge. If one hand is not grounded, this will not work. If the metal is not touching my skin, it will not work. Electricity always obeys the laws of physics; it will always seek the path of least resistance. My truck weighs over two tons, and most of it is metal, so there is plenty of capacitance (ability to absorb and temporarily store an electrical charge). I used to get seizures within 1/2 mile of cell phone towers as well as when I was driving under high voltage power lines. My eyes are always scanning the air waves for such indications of electrical pollution. This has become second nature to me. I have managed many of my triggers by employing the same principles.
 
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Heheheh, drilling hole in the head is nothing compared to the horseshoe incision they needed to do to me when i had to have my brain tumor removed.

Cheers,

:piano: :pop:
 
How about put a ground strap on the brain and be able to ground yourself every time an abnormal electrical activity occurs.QUOTE]

That is exactly what I do when I drive, and I do not have seizures when I drive. I have one end of a jumper cable connected to the seat frame (which is connected to the body frame of my truck), which is connected to a copper wiring "bracelet" touching my skin on my left hand, which holds my steering wheel. The other hand is connected to the chassis, via the shifting rod (manual transmission) which is metallic. The wiring is heavy gauge. If one hand is not grounded, this will not work. If the metal is not touching my skin, it will not work. Electricity always obeys the laws of physics; it will always seek the path of least resistance. My truck weighs over two tons, and most of it is metal, so there is plenty of capacitance (ability to absorb and temporarily store an electrical charge). I used to get seizures within 1/2 mile of cell phone towers as well as when I was driving under high voltage power lines. My eyes are always scanning the air waves for such indications of electrical pollution. This has become second nature to me. I have managed many of my triggers by employing the same principles.
Interesting. Now all you need to do is rig up something like this for the rest of the time (non-driving).

I wonder if I could "ground" my pillow since my seizures are nocturnal.
 
Anti epileptic drugs are trying to largely prevent electrical discharges in the brain. I am simply providing an external avenue for those discharges to travel instead of allowing them to remain in my brain and do their damage.

I am not posting this to be made fun of. I am not sure if people here are taking me seriously. These principles have helped to save my life, as these electrical signals affect my heart conduction, and not just my brain.
 
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That is cool, Michael!! I'll have to think of doing something like that. Any and all precautions when driving a car is the way to go!! As long as it doesn't restrict ones ability to drive, of course.

I remember at the last company I worked at we had floors that were painted with paint that was suppose to ground us when we wore some ground straps on our shoes and connected around our ankles. Probably filled with metallic particles.

I've never caught a catfish, but have caught flounders and perch and bullfrogs. When i use to live up in Seattle area. Flounders and bullfrogs are bottom dwellers and good god what nasty skin they had from dwelling down at that the bottom. Here in the SF bay area, you don't want to eat the fish that swims in the bay, too much mercury in them. I'll stick to eating chicken and beef. :)

:piano: :pop:
 
Michael, I take you seriously AND I am being silly. My brain is currently not too bright and I get silly. You are presenting ideas that I have never thought about before - and I feel badly that I cannot follow you. Also these ideas are on such a level of concreteness that I get nervous. I am used to things being more abstract and taking steps on faith. But I DO take you seriously and know very well that you are being brushed off by lots of people. That is not me. In the meantime have you ever read Erik Kandel's Looking for Memory? He is a very old man now, a neurologist who used a marine worm to map out the electrical workings of a single celled animal. I think Kandel is the one who named the Action Potential, but I may be wrong. Now he is the grand old man of neurology. I think the book may be too simple for you, but maybe not. I loved reading it ten years ago when I HAD a brain. And Kandel is an impressively good human being. So I recommend it just in case.
 
Michael, I DO take you seriously and know very well that you are being brushed off by lots of people. That is not me.
I take you seriously too, Michael. I think your health challenges (those beyond seizures) are something that nobody else around here can claim to really understand. But your scientific reasoning is sound.
 
Michael, The thing that worries me about your situation is that here you are having figured something out that is saving you and is so amazingly creative and nobody really grasps the achievement or is totally thrilled or gives you the credit you so richly deserve. It is an achievement of amazing proportions and people are too ... too something ... stupid? As if they/we don't really get it. If I were in your shoes I think I would be very confused, besides being hurt. I hope you come back and I am afraid you won't.
 
I made the comment about trying to figure out a way to ground my pillow in all seriousness. I hope it wasn't taken as being flip.
 
I remember at the last company I worked at we had floors that were painted with paint that was suppose to ground us when we wore some ground straps on our shoes and connected around our ankles. Probably filled with metallic particles.

Here in the SF bay area, you don't want to eat the fish that swims in the bay, too much mercury in them. I'll stick to eating chicken and beef.

I think the paint on your floor was graphite paint. I have wondered about its effectiveness. Did it work? I used to think, if my financial situation turns around, of buying some and at least painting my bedroom. I presently have some aluminum foil on the exterior walls. One night I forgot to cover the corner, and had seizures. There is a cell phone tower right in lne with the corner unimpeded. My neighbor's friend is an electrician, and he also told me about grounding straps.

My reason for abstaining from bottomdwellers is in part because of mercury. I do however have tuna from time to time.
 
I made the comment about trying to figure out a way to ground my pillow in all seriousness. I hope it wasn't taken as being flip.

I did not take it so. I will respond more at another time. My brain is needing a vacation for now.
 
AlohaBird,

I would caution against having a groudable pillow. I think it is too close to your brain. I tried an aluminum weave of wires around my neck, grounded to my truck, but it did not work as well as when my hand is grounded. I suspect it had to do with its proximity to my brain. Some of the electricity "in the neighborhood" would react with my brain.

If you have a metallic bed-frame, then I might try that. If the saturation point/capacitance (ability to absorb electricity) of the ground is too low, and if the amount of electricity generated by a seizure is too great, then the only thing a ground will do is postpone and possibly shorten a seizure somewhat. The excess electrical energy from the brain will eventually be converted into mechanical energy in the body. The larger the capacity of the ground, the less likely it will reach a point of saturation, and the less likely the energy from the ground will flow backwards into you.

People with EMF sensitivity sometimes connect one foot to ground when sleeping. There are also canopies that are sold with a silver weave throughout as shielding. You may have to experiment with an adequate gauge of wire, as well as the proper mass/size of the ground. A copper weave would be the most comfortable. I like to use larger gauge wires because they can conduct the most electricity away from me when necessary.

Do not connect to a ground in an outlet. It is already conducting small (although normally safe) amounts of electricity.
 
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