Amnesia?

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DadofTwins

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Hello All,

I have a question about amnesia.

My daughter had 2 grand mal seizures at school and was hospitalized twice. Each time, she did not remember from about 2-3 minutes before the seizure until she woke up in the ambulance, 20-30 minutes.

She has since had 2 additional events while sleeping, and forget EVERYTHING that she had experienced in the previous 24 hours.

I have been unable to find anything on this experience.

Doctor implied it is psychological.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Tom
 
For me, the few times I've had Tonic-Clonics (Grand Mal), it's been a similar experience.

It starts as a simple partial, goes to a partial complex, then shifts into the TC seizure.
As I understand it, this is because the seizure originates in a small part of the brain, then the abnormal activity spreads to other parts of the brain, causing the partial-complex, and if it continues this spread it develops into a TC seizure.

For me, once it goes into partial-complex, I'm not conscious. However the convulsions, for me, won't come unless it goes into a TC seizure. So often people won't recognize the intial part of the seizure, because to most people a seizure is just the convulsions.

I'll try and describe the time frame for you. Format for time is Minutes : Seconds. This all starts with a hard to describe aura about 10 minutes before things start.

0:00 - Partial starts
0:30 - Partial spreads to partial-complex. Consciousness is lost.
1:30 - PC is still spreading.
1:50 - PC becomes Tonic-Clonic. Convulsions start.
4:00 - Convulsions end.
19:00 - Consciousness begins to come back. Can remember bits and pieces. Very out of it.
35:00 - Fully aware.

Some people come back from them quickly. Others take a very long time to get their bearings. It depends on the person, and everyone is different.
This is my own experience for TCs, but hopefully it'll help you understand a little better what may be happening with your daughter. :)

As far as the losing 24 hours... Honestly I have no idea. Do her seizures originate from the Hippocampus? That's the memory center of the brain.
 
Tom - Was your daughter given Ativan? They use Ativan to cause Amnesia like affect during surgeries while in twilight. It could be that. I have got hrs of not remembering what happened after having a TC not a 24 hrs. I really don't think it is psychological.

Wish you and your daughter the best!
 
While psychological stress could be playing a minor role in her retrograde amnesia, it's pretty normal to have seizures wipe out big chunks of memory, especially if the seizures are occurring in the part of the brain near the hippocampus (where memories are encoded).

In electroshock therapy for depression (which is essentially a grand mal seizure administered in a controlled setting), it's common for patients to lose their memory of the entire week prior to the ECT session.
 
Hi Tom,

I've had E for over 30 years now and have experienced CP and TC seizures. Usually for me, I don't remember a thing after the aura (also simple partial seizure) starts. Often times, I have trouble remembering hours after the seizure, especially if it has been a TC. I also have trouble remembering names, words, people, etc. And for the dr. to imply that it is psychological is simply irrational on his/her part. Trouble remembering is a part of epilepsy, especially if it is in the temporal lobe. As Silat said, if there is damage in the hippocampus, like for me, that definitely can cause memory problems.

Here is a website that may be informative:
TYPES OF MEMORY PROBLEMS
http://www.epilepsy.com/articles/ar_1063660416
 
Thanks!

Silat said:
For me, the few times I've had Tonic-Clonics (Grand Mal), it's been a similar experience.

It starts as a simple partial, goes to a partial complex, then shifts into the TC seizure.
As I understand it, this is because the seizure originates in a small part of the brain, then the abnormal activity spreads to other parts of the brain, causing the partial-complex, and if it continues this spread it develops into a TC seizure.

For me, once it goes into partial-complex, I'm not conscious. However the convulsions, for me, won't come unless it goes into a TC seizure. So often people won't recognize the intial part of the seizure, because to most people a seizure is just the convulsions.

I'll try and describe the time frame for you. Format for time is Minutes : Seconds. This all starts with a hard to describe aura about 10 minutes before things start.

0:00 - Partial starts
0:30 - Partial spreads to partial-complex. Consciousness is lost.
1:30 - PC is still spreading.
1:50 - PC becomes Tonic-Clonic. Convulsions start.
4:00 - Convulsions end.
19:00 - Consciousness begins to come back. Can remember bits and pieces. Very out of it.
35:00 - Fully aware.

Some people come back from them quickly. Others take a very long time to get their bearings. It depends on the person, and everyone is different.
This is my own experience for TCs, but hopefully it'll help you understand a little better what may be happening with your daughter. :)

As far as the losing 24 hours... Honestly I have no idea. Do her seizures originate from the Hippocampus? That's the memory center of the brain.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the detailed response.

The 2 TC's lasted less than a 40 seconds each without an aura.

The memory loss came after "events" during sleep.

Tom
 
Thanks!

LW6279 said:
Tom - Was your daughter given Ativan? They use Ativan to cause Amnesia like affect during surgeries while in twilight. It could be that. I have got hrs of not remembering what happened after having a TC not a 24 hrs. I really don't think it is psychological.

Wish you and your daughter the best!
Click to expand...

Not on Ativan. The amnesia occurred days later after two subsequent "events" during sleep, not during the T/C Seizures.
 
If she had a seizure in her sleep which involved the Hippocampus part of her brain, she very easily could have a chunk of memory lost.

The Hippocampus is responsible for taking short and medium term memories and converting them into long-term memories for access to later in time. A seizure that involves that section of the brain could easily disrupt that process and the person who experienced it could lose a section of short/medium term memory that hasn't been made a long term memory yet.

That's the only way I can think of seizures causing amnesia. It's possible, but to my knowledge it's only possible if the hippocampus is involved.

Hopefully this is helpful?
 
Silat said:
The Hippocampus is responsible for taking short and medium term memories and converting them into long-term memories for access to later in time. A seizure that involves that section of the brain could easily disrupt that process and the person who experienced it could lose a section of short/medium term memory that hasn't been made a long term memory yet.

That's the only way I can think of seizures causing amnesia. It's possible, but to my knowledge it's only possible if the hippocampus is involved.
Click to expand...

:agree: to some degree. However, parts of the amygdala as well as the hippocampus on both sides are responsible for memory as are some of the medications. Having seizure after seizure can cause long term memory loss, also. I've had many TC's that started as a CP and then went into a secondary TC seizure. My first TC was when I was burned and my family said I attacked the paramedics and my father. I remember nothing about that day, except the "Flight for Life" ride to the hospital, and even that is very "fuzzy".

Hippocampus from Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ammon's_horn
Epilepsy
The hippocampus is often the focus of epileptic seizures: hippocampal sclerosis is the most commonly visible type of tissue damage in temporal lobe epilepsy. It is not yet clear, though, whether the epilepsy is usually caused by hippocampal abnormalities, or the hippocampus is damaged by cumulative effects of seizures. In experimental settings where repetitive seizures are artificially induced in animals, hippocampal damage is a frequent result: this may be a consequence of the hippocampus being one of the most electrically excitable parts of the brain. It may also have something to do with the fact that the hippocampus is one of very few brain regions where new neurons continue to be created throughout life.
Click to expand...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amygdala#Memory_modulation

The amygdala is also involved in the modulation of memory consolidation. Following any learning event, the long-term memory for the event is not formed instantaneously. Rather, information regarding the event is slowly assimilated into long-term (potentially life-long) storage over time, possibly via long-term potentiation. Recent studies suggest that, while the amygdala is not itself a long-term memory storage site, and learning can occur without it, one of its roles is to regulate memory consolidation in other brain regions. Also, fear conditioning, a type of memory that is impaired following amygdala damage, is mediated in part by long-term potentiation.
Click to expand...
 
The amygdala...
Thanks Cint! I learn something new every day on this forum :)
 
Thanks!

Silat said:
If she had a seizure in her sleep which involved the Hippocampus part of her brain, she very easily could have a chunk of memory lost.

The Hippocampus is responsible for taking short and medium term memories and converting them into long-term memories for access to later in time. A seizure that involves that section of the brain could easily disrupt that process and the person who experienced it could lose a section of short/medium term memory that hasn't been made a long term memory yet.

That's the only way I can think of seizures causing amnesia. It's possible, but to my knowledge it's only possible if the hippocampus is involved.

Hopefully this is helpful?
Click to expand...


Very helpful!

Thanks!
 
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